From dwhite7 at san.rr.com Thu Mar 1 08:36:21 2007 From: dwhite7 at san.rr.com (Dave White) Date: Thu, 1 Mar 2007 05:36:21 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] March is Pedal to the Park Registration Month Message-ID: Pedal to the Park, Sunday April 29th - a benefit ride for a great cause. Participants will be seated together at PETCO Park. 3 ways to participate, using the 10, 25, or 40 mile routes: * Cycling Only ($20) * Cycling and Padres/Dodgers game ($30) * Game Only ($30) All the information is at http://www.active.com/event_detail.cfm?event_id=1376660 PRELIMINARY route maps and elevation profiles are available on request at p2park at san.rr.com. Full detailed route slips will be available at the ride. Thanks for the support, Dave White Founder and Event Director, Pedal to the Park SDCBC and NCCC are Supporting Partners; DSAC/TRS is Benefit Partner From execdir at sdcbc.org Fri Mar 2 18:50:56 2007 From: execdir at sdcbc.org (Kathy Keehan) Date: Fri, 2 Mar 2007 15:50:56 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] FW: Road closure... Message-ID: <002f01c75d25$9eb602d0$6401a8c0@KathyDell> You may have read about this in the newspaper, but just in case, if you're riding on 78 be aware that the road will be closed at the San Felipe Creek Bridge. March 12 to March 23. Kathy -----Original Message----- From: Bob James [mailto:bob_james at dot.ca.gov] Sent: Friday, March 02, 2007 3:40 PM To: Kathy Keehan Cc: Chris Schmidt; Bob James Subject: Road closure... Hi Kathy: -snip- A portion of SR-78 will be closed COMPLETELY (at the San Felipe Creek Bridge) for much needed repair work. (This area/bridge is about 12 miles east of Julian.) It will be closed beginning Monday, March 12 to mid-day Friday, March 23, 2007. -snip- Bob James District 11 Bicycle/Pedestrian Coordinator Department of Transportation (Caltrans) 4050 Taylor Street, MS-240 San Diego, CA. 92110 Tell: (619) 688-4206 Cell: (619) 929-1866 Phax: (619) 688-2511 From rob_leone at earthlink.net Sat Mar 3 09:04:55 2007 From: rob_leone at earthlink.net (Robert Leone) Date: Sat, 03 Mar 2007 06:04:55 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] Gilman/I-5 area challenges for cyclists. Message-ID: <45E98087.90109@earthlink.net> Dear Mr. Rizzo: Hello! Here's the list of problems with the Gilman Drive/I-5 connection from a cyclist's perspective you'd asked for. I'm taking the liberty of carbon copying this to the San Diego County Bicycle Coalition listserv -- some of the posters there have much more traffic control device experience than I, and may be able to suggest better solutions. Robert Leone Gilman/I-5 Cycling Issues. Dear Mr. Rizzo: Hello! You'd asked for a comprehensive list of issues and problems with the Gilman Drive/I-5 intersection from a cyclists' perspective. First off, although I am a member of the San Diego County Bicycle Coalition, I am not writing here on behalf of the coalition or of any of its club or individual members. While this list is as complete as I can make it at this time, it is not meant to represent all issues that have arisen or may arise in the future. Further, where possible I have tried to devise schemes to remediate some of these problems, but I am not a professional engineer or urban planner. I may have missed an obvious or known solution to any number of specific problems. I will try to mention problem areas and concerns in geographic order, from North to South, as if I were heading southbound on Gilman Drive heading for I-5 and the Rose Canyon Bike Path. 1. The dirt embankment above the west curb of Gilman Drive between Villa La Jolla Drive and the apartment complex just north of the Gilman Drive Park & Ride lot is subject to land slips during rains. It's disconcerting, and can be dangerous to cyclists at night who have little warning to merge left to avoid six inch (diameter) sand clods, or during rush hours where therre's precious little space between southbound traffic to effect an easy merge. A solution would be slope stabilization with coir matting or other naturally-based fiberous material, or a real retaining wall. 2. Gilman Drive's shoulder area going past the apartment complex just north of the Park and Ride lot narrows about fifty or so feet before the bike line recommences. I'm going by memory here, so the distances I cite may be off a bit. Ad to that a tendency among those who use street parking to park all the way to the restart of the bike lane, and you have a situation where cyclists must decide whether they'd rather ride in the right tire track or center of the rightmost travel lane, or ride in the "door zone" of the parked cars. A solution would be to widen this shoulder area all the way to the recommencement of the bike lane. Another solution would be a section of red curbing before the recommencement of the bike lane. 3. I have observed much comment in the past month about the transition from riding in the bike lane to the right of all the motorized traffic lanes to riding in the bike lane to the left of the designated right turn lane onto I-5. I personally start looking back to see if there's space for me to move to the left of the rightmost lane at about the time I see the entrance to the Park and Ride lot. A solution to this may be more obvious directions to cyclists to merge left and designation of the rightmost lane as a right turn lane onto I-5 a bit further to the north. By "obvious" I mean obvious to both cyclists and other road users. Perhaps in addition to the lane assignmnt sign on the side of the road south of the Park and Ride lot entrance a lane assignment sign could be placed about where the lit-up "Prepare to Stop" sign is -- above the road itself. 4. The proposed solution to problem 3, a more obvious (and earlier) lane assignment sign could also be of help with problem 4 -- folks in the through traffic lane turning right to get to the freeway onramp, cutting off cyclists in the through bike lane to their right. In part this is due to a discontinuity between the freeway onramp and the approach to same. A few years ago, the freeway onramp was turned into two lanes, one of them for high occupancy vehicles. Metering was added at the same time. However, the turn lane (and "storage," I believe that's the term) into the I-5 southbound onramp is still one lane. It does seem a bit odd to have a setup where folks in HOvs sit with the regular flow of traffic for a bit before separating out into a more priviledged lane. A more engineering-intensive solution might be two turn lanes, one for HOVs -- but this "solution" would complicate the merge to the left for through-traffic cyclists. 5. Motorists coming off I-5 northbound and turning onto La Jolla Colony Road often cut off the curb cut and entrance to the Rose Canyon Bike Path. This sometimes causes cyclists to have to stop in the middle of the street and "negotiate" with motorists to make sure the motorists stay stationary as the cyclists try to clear the intersection before the light changes. A possible solution would be improving signage. There is already a yellow biycle graphic trapezoid sign and a "stop Here on Red" sign right there. I would suggest adding a "crossing" sign to the bike trapezoid sign, changing the "stop Here on Red" to "wait Here on Red" and adding a sign indicating the entrance to the Rose Canyon Bike Path. 6. I've spoken to both motorists and an occasional cyclist who didn't believe there was a bike path from the UCSD area to Pacific Beach with connections on south. A fair majority of my coworkers think my two-or-three-times-a-week bicycle commute is through downtown La jolla and up La Jolla Scenic or La Jolla Shores and somehow onto Miramar Road. A nice big sign (matching the one at the northern end of Santa Fe Street at the southern end of the Rose Canyon Bike Path) would be helpful, especially with newcomers to San Diego such as UCsD campus residents. 7. I can't think of any real solution, but it's a tough transition from being a cyclist on La jolla Colony to being a cyclist on the Rose Canyon bike path! This might be galling to some cyclists because if I-5 had cycling access between Gilman and Garnet/Balboa, they'd simply ride up to the left turn onto the I-5 southbound onramp. 8. There is some damaged pavement in the bike lane on La Jolla Colony about thirty or forty feet before it intersects with the I-5 offramp. A little patching would be fine. 9. I will e-mail you separately, with a picture, about the persistant puddle problem on the Rose Canyon Bike Path itself. I hope this helps. I emphasize again this is a personal list, and neither it nor the solutions I suggest are policy statements from any cycling organization. Yours, Robert Leone From execdir at sdcbc.org Sun Mar 4 00:07:49 2007 From: execdir at sdcbc.org (Kathy Keehan) Date: Sat, 3 Mar 2007 21:07:49 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] FW: Bike Commuter Info Message-ID: <002701c75e1b$0dcf8420$6401a8c0@KathyDell> Hi All, This nice woman is a second grade teacher in San Ysidro and would like to commute from North Park and is looking for some potential fellow riders. Please email her or me if you might like to coordinate your commutes. Kathy -----Original Message----- From: mldunn.9 at juno.com [mailto:mldunn.9 at juno.com] Sent: Saturday, March 03, 2007 6:10 PM To: execdir at sdcbc.org Subject: Bike Commuter Info 3-3-07 Hi Kathy, My name is Maura and I met you today at the Cultivating Food Justice. I work in San Ysidro and was trying to figure out a way to ride to work. You mentioned (your husband?) that rides one way to work, leaves the car there and then rides home the next day. I was wondering if there are any people riding to San Ysidro from San Diego. You also mentioned that the trolley does not require the commute card anymore nor do they restrict the timing of putting a bike on the trolley. Thanks for your help, Maura Dunn North Park From execdir at sdcbc.org Sun Mar 4 22:36:50 2007 From: execdir at sdcbc.org (Kathy Keehan) Date: Sun, 4 Mar 2007 19:36:50 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] FW: [Cyclo-Vets] Omnium Message-ID: <001a01c75ed7$82b1f9f0$8815edd0$@org> Cyclo-Vets still need some volunteers for the Omnium. It's a fun event, and I'm sure they would welcome some volunteers from SDCBC. Kathy From: Cyclo-Vets at yahoogroups.com [mailto:Cyclo-Vets at yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of joe griffin Sent: Sunday, March 04, 2007 6:16 PM To: cyclo-vets at yahoogroups.com Subject: [Cyclo-Vets] Omnium Our fellow Cyclovets, Last year Joe and I volunteered at the Omnium. We were very impressed with the wonderful people we met in the club and their commitment to helping make the Omnium successful. With the Omnium fast approaching...five weeks away, April 13-15 we are still in need of volunteers. Please consider a morning or afternoon shift on one or more of these days. We are also in need of a trailer or a motor home for the officials to record the results. Thank you, Julie and Joe Griffin (619) 445-7349 [Non-text portions of this message have been removed] __._,_.___ Messages in this topic (2) Reply (via web post) | Start a new topic Messages | Files | Photos | Links | Database | Polls | Calendar Image removed by sender. Yahoo! Groups Change settings via the Web (Yahoo! ID required) Change settings via email: Switch delivery to Daily Digest | Switch format to Traditional Visit Your Group | Yahoo! Groups Terms of Use | Unsubscribe Visit Your Group Give Back Yahoo! for Good Get inspired by a good cause. Y! Toolbar Get it Free! easy 1-click access to your groups. Yahoo! Groups Start a group in 3 easy steps. Connect with others. . Image removed by sender. __,_._,___ -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.bikesandiego.org/pipermail/sdcbc/attachments/20070304/cb46c0dc/attachment-0001.html -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: image/jpeg Size: 353 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.bikesandiego.org/pipermail/sdcbc/attachments/20070304/cb46c0dc/attachment-0002.jpe -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: not available Type: image/jpeg Size: 332 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.bikesandiego.org/pipermail/sdcbc/attachments/20070304/cb46c0dc/attachment-0003.jpe From dianeb at qualcomm.com Mon Mar 5 15:06:48 2007 From: dianeb at qualcomm.com (Diane Brown) Date: Mon, 05 Mar 2007 12:06:48 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] QUALCOMM Million Dollar Challenge bike ride!!!! Message-ID: <7.0.1.0.2.20070305120618.0255ad98@qualcomm.com> Dear Friends, Last year, I was privileged to be selected to participate in the inaugural QUALCOMM Million Dollar Challenge. The Million Dollar Challenge is a bicycle ride from San Francisco to San Diego and it benefits the Challenged Athletes Foundation. This was an experience unlike any I had ever had before! The ride was the most scenic ride I have ever done and it was the hardest ride I have ever done! I couldn't wait to sign up for the 2007 ride! What is the Challenged Athletes Foundation? The CAF raises money to help people with physical disabilities pursue an active lifestyle through physical fitness and competitive athletics. I was honored to be able to ride with some of these athletes last year. I am able to call them friends as we had many adventures during our 640 mile journey! I have signed up to participate in the Second Annual QUALCOMM Million Dollar Challenge! The ride takes place from October 20th - 26th. The minimum fundraising amount is $10,000.00. I need your help to reach this goal. Will you please support me in my endeavor to help the Challenged Athletes Foundation? Did you know that people with disabilities are a minority group AND the ONLY minority group that *anyone* can join during their life? I need to do my part to ensure that the CAF is able to help those that need it. Your contribution is greatly appreciated! Please use this link to sponsor me today....just enter my name to help! < http://mdc2007.kintera.org/faf/home/default.asp?ievent=226002> Thanks very much for your kind support! --Diane -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.bikesandiego.org/pipermail/sdcbc/attachments/20070305/9443b493/attachment.html From execdir at sdcbc.org Mon Mar 5 17:28:23 2007 From: execdir at sdcbc.org (Kathy Keehan) Date: Mon, 5 Mar 2007 14:28:23 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] FW: I-15.northbound,continued access Message-ID: <004001c75f75$95d7f900$c187eb00$@org> Our friends at Caltrans will be working on the northbound I-15 shoulder access across Lake Hodges this week. While access will remain open for bicyclists, you will have to dismount and walk a short distance at the trail connection while they do some work on the slopes. They're saying it will only take a couple of days, so hopefully they will be done by this weekend. Please tell anyone you might know who uses I-15 across Lake Hodges. Kathy Subject: I-15.northbound,continued access Hi Kathy, Just spoke with the project engineer for the issue about the temporary removal and replacement of the asphalt bike path that currently takes northbound bicycles from the shoulder of I-15 down to the River Park paved/pcc surface. They cannot do the new path segment first because part of the project is to add additional material onto the slope, which will include that portion that will have the new asphalt concrete surface. I have been assured that the access between the shoulder of I-15 and the river park path will NOT be closed. Bikes will continue to be admitted through the project site, but they will have to dismount and walk their bikes down the slope to the park path. I was also assured that the surface that bicycle riders will have to walk on will fairly smooth, such that, riders in cleats will not have much difficulty either. (we will see...) There will be a sign prior to where bicycle riders will need to dismount, telling them that they will need to dismount and walk their bikes. I have also been told that this temporary modification work should not last more than a couple days, and everything will be back as normal after then. (The new path segment will be in, the new access will be opened, and bikes will not need to dismount.) They want to start this work TOMORROW MORNING. The sign will be in-place and work will begin. Assuming only a couple days of the bike access being disrupted, I would expect that all would be back to normal by the weekend, for sure. Of course, if not, then you will be the first...second one to hear about it. (I will be the first...) If you can put a notice on your website, that would be great. Again, bicycle riders will NOT be denied access; they will only be inconvenienced a bit. Bob James District 11 Bicycle/Pedestrian Coordinator Department of Transportation (Caltrans) 4050 Taylor Street, MS-240 San Diego, CA. 92110 Tell: (619) 688-4206 Cell: (619) 929-1866 Phax: (619) 688-2511 From pje at efgh.com Mon Mar 5 19:06:49 2007 From: pje at efgh.com (Philip Erdelsky) Date: Mon, 05 Mar 2007 16:06:49 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] [Fwd: Bicycle Clubs in San Diego] Message-ID: <45ECB099.4080203@efgh.com> I've referred them to a bike rental store in Downtown San Diego. Can any SDCBC member give them help with other things? -- Philip Erdelsky -------- Original Message -------- From: - Mon Mar 05 15:52:34 2007 From: mdenis at cmhc-schl.gc.ca Date: Mon, 5 Mar 2007 10:52:15 -0500 Hi, My My boyfriend (Randy) and I (Marie-Jos?e) are going down to San Diego to do some cycling between March 29 and April 4th. We are both from Ottawa, Canada. We would certainly like to hook up with others to do some cycling in a group and discover the surrounds of San Diego. He trains for thriatlons and I am an avid cyclist. O was wondering if you could not send my request to your listing of clubs. Perhaps some clubs have outings planned during that period and we could join them. As well, if there are any cycling club members who would be intererested in renting us a room with access to kitchen and shower, we may be quite interested in that option. OK last question. We both have thinking that it may be easier to rent a bike in San Diego instead of bringing ours down. Do you know of a place where we could rent a good quality high performance road bikes, preferablly carbon frame, look pedas.... All this to say, I would appreciate it very much if you could forward this email to every club and members you have on your list. Perhaps we would be lucky. Thanks a bunch. Bonne journ?e Marie-Josee Denis Senior Officer, Strategic Initiatives Community Development Phone: 613- 748-2444 | Fax: (613) 748-5107 Email: mdenis at cmhc-schl.gc.ca 700 Montreal Road, A1-252, Ottawa, Ontario, K1A 0P7 Canada Mortgage and Housing Corporation (CMHC) www.cmhc.ca From gmikeg at gmail.com Wed Mar 7 01:02:04 2007 From: gmikeg at gmail.com (Michael Guerrero) Date: Tue, 6 Mar 2007 22:02:04 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] Fwd: Camino del Norte @ Camino del Sur barricade In-Reply-To: <31b0064e0702121715o5e5be905k924c674005616298@mail.gmail.com> References: <0d7a017bae2e9949d6623bc22903a5b0@san.rr.com> <31b0064e0702121715o5e5be905k924c674005616298@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <328c49b0703062202p7064e07embb6b3e44876c3f53@mail.gmail.com> The road is now open! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.bikesandiego.org/pipermail/sdcbc/attachments/20070307/ba66591b/attachment.html From tlettington at san.rr.com Wed Mar 7 01:08:15 2007 From: tlettington at san.rr.com (Tom Lettington) Date: Tue, 06 Mar 2007 22:08:15 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] Fwd: Camino del Norte @ Camino del Sur barricade In-Reply-To: <328c49b0703062202p7064e07embb6b3e44876c3f53@mail.gmail.com > References: <0d7a017bae2e9949d6623bc22903a5b0@san.rr.com> <31b0064e0702121715o5e5be905k924c674005616298@mail.gmail.com> <328c49b0703062202p7064e07embb6b3e44876c3f53@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <200703070606.l2766rw2026419@ms-smtp-02.socal.rr.com> Great, Now if we could just get Carmel Valley Road open all the way through to Bernardo Center we'd be in business. - Tom At 10:02 PM 3/6/2007, Michael Guerrero wrote: >The road is now open! >_______________________________________________ > >You are subscribed to the SDCBC mailing list as tlettington at san.rr.com >To unsubscribe or change mailing options, go to >http://www.bikesandiego.org/mailman/listinfo/sdcbc >List privacy information is located at http://www.stickman-computing.org/aup >For help or to talk with someone other than the mail robot, send >e-mail to postmaster at stickman-computing.org From execdir at sdcbc.org Wed Mar 7 11:54:26 2007 From: execdir at sdcbc.org (Kathy Keehan) Date: Wed, 7 Mar 2007 08:54:26 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] Ride and Learn March 11th Message-ID: <005e01c760d9$442e4040$cc8ac0c0$@org> This Sunday, March 11th - Ride and Learn in Coronado. Join us for a fun ride around Coronado. Beginner riders welcome, so tell your friends! Meet at the park at the end of Mullinix Drive (go all the way down to the circular drive parking lot past the soccer fields) at 9:15 for a 9:30 start. Call or email if you have questions. Kathy Keehan Executive Director San Diego County Bicycle Coalition P.O. Box 34544 San Diego, CA 92163 858.487.6063 execdir at sdcbc.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.bikesandiego.org/pipermail/sdcbc/attachments/20070307/194575b0/attachment.html From JimBaross at cox.net Wed Mar 7 19:48:34 2007 From: JimBaross at cox.net (Jim Baross) Date: Wed, 07 Mar 2007 16:48:34 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] Wanna be a Urban Bicycle Warrior? Message-ID: <7.0.1.0.2.20070307164331.03859db0@cox.net> Urban Bike Warriors Date: Three Saturday afternoons. Location: San Diego, California 92116 Fee: free!!! normally $50. Course will be limited to the first eight to registrations. Description: So, you want to take back the streets? Me too! This is the course for you if you want to be a bicycling ambassador and to ride as a "criticalmass of one" sort of bicyclist. We will cover Road 1 material from an assertive cyclist approach to bicycling legally in and with other traffic. Be prepared to learn legal ways to get the respect we deserve while enhancing your safety and increasing your bicycling effectiveness and efficiency. WOW, what a course!! AND, it's FREE! This course is 12:30 until 4:00 PM on three successive Saturdays, March 17, 24, and 31 in and around the Normal Heights/Mid-City area of San Diego, California. To register for this course, contact: Jim Baross or Kathy Keehan Phone: 619-280-6908 Contact Email: jimbaross at cox.net Website: www.sdcbc.org Signup required in advance. Contact instructor directly via jimbaross at cox.net or 619-280-6908. Or register through www.sdcbc.org. Equipment required: multi-speed bicycle, bicycle helmet, courage and desire -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.bikesandiego.org/pipermail/sdcbc/attachments/20070307/b39d1e92/attachment-0001.html From JimBaross at cox.net Thu Mar 8 11:36:26 2007 From: JimBaross at cox.net (Jim Baross) Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2007 08:36:26 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] Ignorance of traffic law and rights, was Re: Rules of the road Message-ID: <7.0.1.0.2.20070308082814.03814308@cox.net> I put this together for Mack, responding to a question to CBC, and thought it's probably worth copying to the SDCBC list, FYI and reminder that "roads are for people, not only for people in cars." -------Original Message------- From: Mack L Date: 3/6/2007 2:55:59 PM To: info at bikelink.com Subject: Rules of the road I'm a CBC member and have commuted to work daily in San Jose since 1970. I ride a road bike most days, but I have a Bike Friday with trailer and on weekends I get my groceries with it. My routes in both instances include some relatively heavily traveled thoroughfares with two lanes each way plus separate left-turn lanes, sometimes with market bike lanes, sometimes not. With Bike Friday and trailer, I was recently stopped in a left-turn lane by a nonuniformed man in a police van who told me to bet back on the sidewalk. I acted incredulously at the sidewalk comment, and he told me I was in a driving lane and he would cite me if I didn't comply. I didn't tempt him. I recently was yelled at both with the Bike Friday and my road bike when I used a left-turn lane. I've looked at the DMV test booklet and see nothing that would prevent me from using those lanes. Am I wrong? Mack L. To: "Mack L The person(s) who directed or suggested that you are not allowed to bicycle and/or to tow a bike trailer in normal traffic lanes was in error... though the error in understanding California vehicle laws relating to bicycling in with traffic is unfortunately widespread. Legally operated bicycling belongs most appropriately on-road with other traffic, not on sidewalks. In many cities, in recognition of the potential dangers, it's even illegal to ride a bike on a sidewalk. Here below is the Calif Veh Code section on the rights of bicyclists. Notice bicyclists have the same rights as a driver of a vehicle. I am also attaching a file compilation of CVC that have special interest to bicyclists. Enjoy. [The list-server will likely not carry the attachment. If you'd like a copy of the file, just ask.] Short of carrying a copy of the (whole) CVC, I have had little success at educating ill informed motorists while out there on the road. Maybe a polite note/letter to the appropriate law enforcement agency would get the info to the officer? Operation of Bicycles on California Roadways 21200. (a) Every person riding a bicycle upon a highway has all the rights and is subject to all the provisions applicable to the driver of a vehicle by this division, including, but not limited to, provisions concerning driving under the influence of alcoholic beverages or drugs, and by Division 10 (commencing with Section 20000), Section 27400, Division 16.7 (commencing with Section 39000), Division 17 (commencing with Section 40000.1), and Division 18 (commencing with Section 42000), except those provisions which by their very nature can have no application. (b) (1) Any peace officer, as defined in Chapter 4.5 (commencing with Section 830) of Title 3 of Part 2 of the Penal Code, operating a bicycle during the course of his or her duties is exempt from the requirements of subdivision (a), except as those requirements relate to driving under the influence of alcoholic beverages or drugs, if the bicycle is being operated under any of the following circumstances: (A) In response to an emergency call. (B) While engaged in rescue operations. (C) In the immediate pursuit of an actual or suspected violator of the law. (2) This subdivision does not relieve a peace officer from the duty to operate a bicycle with due regard for the safety of all persons using the highway. Thanks for asking. Jim Baross San Diego, California Chair, SANDAG Bicycle Pedestrian Working Group Vice Chair, Calif. Bicycle Advisory Committee President, Calif. Association of Bicycle Organizations Board Member, Calif. Bicycle Coalition Chair, Calif. Strategic Highway Safety Plan, Bicycling Safety Spokesperson, San Diego County Bicycle Coalition League Trainer & Effective Cycling Instructor #185 K-C "Cyclists should expect and demand safe accommodation on our public roads, just as does every other user. Nothing more is expected. Nothing less is acceptable." Jack R. Taylor "Cyclists fare best when they act and are treated as drivers of vehicles." John Forester "Same Roads Same Rules Same Rights" SDCBC "Roads are for people, not just for people in cars." Jim Baross -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.bikesandiego.org/pipermail/sdcbc/attachments/20070308/624aa5cd/attachment.html From execdir at sdcbc.org Thu Mar 8 12:27:14 2007 From: execdir at sdcbc.org (Kathy Keehan) Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2007 09:27:14 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] FW: Fiesta Island Changes Message-ID: <008601c761a7$03911160$0ab33420$@org> From: Kathy Keehan [mailto:execdir at sdcbc.org] Sent: Thursday, March 08, 2007 9:24 AM To: Sdcbc (sdcbc at bikesandiego.org); Sdcbcboard at Calvin. Edu (sdcbcboard at calvin.ucsd.edu) Subject: FW: Fiesta Island Changes Fiesta Island "Workshop" March 22nd, 6:30 p.m. at the Balboa Park Club ballroom. From what I understand, it will be like the Mission Valley Library open house workshop, to review the proposed changes to Fiesta Island. If you ride on Fiesta Island, plan to be at that meeting! Please spread the word. Kathy -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.bikesandiego.org/pipermail/sdcbc/attachments/20070308/6e9fde87/attachment.html From JimBaross at cox.net Thu Mar 8 12:55:24 2007 From: JimBaross at cox.net (Jim Baross) Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2007 09:55:24 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] Chula Vista Bayfront Public Meetings Message-ID: <7.0.1.0.2.20070308095104.03731438@cox.net> Chula Vista continues its public workshops on their bayfront master plan. You might be interested in what they plan for bike access to and through this area of San Diego Bay between D St and the power plant site. www.portofsandiego.org/projects/cvbmp/ Next meeting March 15 at 3:30 pm and 6:00 PM. From serge at issakov.org Thu Mar 8 20:29:46 2007 From: serge at issakov.org (Serge Issakov) Date: Thu, 8 Mar 2007 17:29:46 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] Ignorance of traffic law and rights, was Re: Rules of the road In-Reply-To: <7.0.1.0.2.20070308082814.03814308@cox.net> References: <7.0.1.0.2.20070308082814.03814308@cox.net> Message-ID: <69ec985b0703081729j26cf2b10gfc92524e3d42ec29@mail.gmail.com> I kind of wish Mack pushed for the citation, just to see what would happen. I'm guessing the officer wouldn't be able to find an appropriate section of the vehicle code to cite him with, and let him go. The only one that comes close is 21202 (the "keep right" law), but that has an explicit exception (among many others) for turning left. Serge On 3/8/07, Jim Baross wrote: > > I put this together for Mack, responding to a question to CBC, and thought > it's probably worth copying to the SDCBC list, FYI and reminder that "roads > are for people, not only for people in cars." > > -------Original Message------- > From: Mack L > Date: 3/6/2007 2:55:59 PM > To: info at bikelink.com > Subject: Rules of the road > > I'm a CBC member and have commuted to work daily in San Jose since 1970. I > ride a road bike most days, but I have a Bike Friday with trailer and on > weekends I get my groceries with it. My routes in both instances include > some relatively heavily traveled thoroughfares with two lanes each way plus > separate left-turn lanes, sometimes with market bike lanes, sometimes not. > > With Bike Friday and trailer, I was recently stopped in a left-turn lane by > a nonuniformed man in a police van who told me to bet back on the sidewalk. > I acted incredulously at the sidewalk comment, and he told me I was in a > driving lane and he would cite me if I didn't comply. I didn't tempt him. > > I recently was yelled at both with the Bike Friday and my road bike when I > used a left-turn lane. > > I've looked at the DMV test booklet and see nothing that would prevent me > from using those lanes. Am I wrong? > > Mack L. > > To: "Mack L > > The person(s) who directed or suggested that you are not allowed to bicycle > and/or to tow a bike trailer in normal traffic lanes was in error... though > the error in understanding California vehicle laws relating to bicycling in > with traffic is unfortunately widespread. Legally operated bicycling belongs > most appropriately on-road with other traffic, not on sidewalks. In many > cities, in recognition of the potential dangers, it's even illegal to ride a > bike on a sidewalk. > > Here below is the Calif Veh Code section on the rights of bicyclists. > Notice bicyclists have the same rights as a driver of a vehicle. > > I am also attaching a file compilation of CVC that have special interest to > bicyclists. Enjoy. [The list-server will likely not carry the attachment. If > you'd like a copy of the file, just ask.] > > Short of carrying a copy of the (whole) CVC, I have had little success at > educating ill informed motorists while out there on the road. Maybe a polite > note/letter to the appropriate law enforcement agency would get the info to > the officer? > > Operation of Bicycles on California Roadways > 21200. (a) Every person riding a bicycle upon a highway has all the rights > and is subject to all the provisions applicable to the driver of a vehicle > by this division, including, but not limited to, provisions concerning > driving under the influence of alcoholic beverages or drugs, and by Division > 10 (commencing with Section 20000), Section 27400, Division 16.7 (commencing > with Section 39000), Division 17 (commencing with Section 40000.1), and > Division 18 (commencing with Section 42000), except those provisions which > by their very nature can have no application. (b) (1) Any peace officer, as > defined in Chapter 4.5 (commencing with Section 830) of Title 3 of Part 2 of > the Penal Code, operating a bicycle during the course of his or her duties > is exempt from the requirements of subdivision (a), except as those > requirements relate to driving under the influence of alcoholic beverages or > drugs, if the bicycle is being operated under any of the following > circumstances: > (A) In response to an emergency call. > (B) While engaged in rescue operations. > (C) In the immediate pursuit of an actual or suspected violator of the > law. > (2) This subdivision does not relieve a peace officer from the duty to > operate a bicycle with due regard for the safety of all persons using the > highway. > > Thanks for asking. > Jim Baross > San Diego, California > > Chair, SANDAG Bicycle Pedestrian Working Group > Vice Chair, Calif. Bicycle Advisory Committee > President, Calif. Association of Bicycle Organizations > Board Member, Calif. Bicycle Coalition > Chair, Calif. Strategic Highway Safety Plan, Bicycling Safety > Spokesperson, San Diego County Bicycle Coalition > League Trainer & Effective Cycling Instructor #185 K-C > > "Cyclists should expect and demand safe accommodation on our public roads, > just as does every other user. > Nothing more is expected. Nothing less is acceptable." > Jack R. Taylor > > "Cyclists fare best when they act and are treated as drivers of vehicles." > John Forester > > "Same Roads Same Rules Same Rights" > SDCBC > > "Roads are for people, not just for people in cars." > Jim Baross > > > _______________________________________________ > > You are subscribed to the SDCBC mailing list as serge at issakov.org > To unsubscribe or change mailing options, go to > http://www.bikesandiego.org/mailman/listinfo/sdcbc > List privacy information is located at > http://www.stickman-computing.org/aup > For help or to talk with someone other than the mail robot, send e-mail to > postmaster at stickman-computing.org > From JimBaross at cox.net Thu Mar 8 20:42:50 2007 From: JimBaross at cox.net (Jim Baross) Date: Thu, 08 Mar 2007 17:42:50 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] Ignorance of traffic law and rights, was Re: Rules of the road In-Reply-To: <69ec985b0703081729j26cf2b10gfc92524e3d42ec29@mail.gmail.co m> References: <7.0.1.0.2.20070308082814.03814308@cox.net> <69ec985b0703081729j26cf2b10gfc92524e3d42ec29@mail.gmail.com> Message-ID: <7.0.1.0.2.20070308174058.03713838@cox.net> Cops can be creative and tickets are time consuming (sometimes expensive) to fight... but sometimes you gotta fight to get noticed if not to win. At 05:29 PM 3/8/2007, Serge Issakov wrote: >I kind of wish Mack pushed for the citation, just to see what would happen. >I'm guessing the officer wouldn't be able to find an appropriate >section of the vehicle code to cite him with, and let him go. > >The only one that comes close is 21202 (the "keep right" law), but >that has an explicit exception (among many others) for turning left. > >Serge > >On 3/8/07, Jim Baross wrote: > > > > I put this together for Mack, responding to a question to CBC, and thought > > it's probably worth copying to the SDCBC list, FYI and reminder that "roads > > are for people, not only for people in cars." - snip - From declan at declan.net Fri Mar 9 12:41:27 2007 From: declan at declan.net (Declan Fleming) Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2007 09:41:27 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] Toronto councillor: dead cyclists have themselves to blame! Message-ID: <31b0064e0703090941n68157ea4gbf33362dfd4ad9f5@mail.gmail.com> *Lots of buzz on this today: * *City councillors on the budget * "I can't support bike lanes. Roads are built for buses, cars, and trucks. My heart bleeds when someone gets killed, but it's their own fault at the end of the day." * ?Rob Ford* * * *I first saw it here:* *http://www.boingboing.net/2007/03/09/toronto_councillor_d.html* ** *Many links to discussion on the topic.* ** *D * -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.bikesandiego.org/pipermail/sdcbc/attachments/20070309/7a6540fb/attachment.html From execdir at sdcbc.org Fri Mar 9 13:49:15 2007 From: execdir at sdcbc.org (Kathy Keehan) Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2007 10:49:15 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] FW: Bikes on roads Message-ID: <001901c7627b$a2dd2590$e89770b0$@org> If people really want to get this guy to change his opinion, sending faxes/calls/emails to the Heart and Stroke Foundation (http://ww2.heartandstroke.ca/privacy/) , which he publicly claims as a supporter/member, might provide some leverage. Toronto Office: Supporting Toronto Area 2300 Yonge Street, Suite 1300 Toronto, Ontario M4P 1E4 Telephone (416) 489-7111 Fax (416) 489-6885 Kathy From: Kathy Keehan [mailto:execdir at sdcbc.org] Sent: Friday, March 09, 2007 10:46 AM To: 'councillor_ford at toronto.ca' Subject: Bikes on roads Dear Councillor Ford, A member of the San Diego County Bicycle Coalition brought to my attention your remarks regarding bicyclists on Toronto roadways. "I can't support bike lanes. Roads are built for buses, cars, and trucks. My heart bleeds when someone gets killed, but it's their own fault at the end of the day." Wow. I'm hoping that you've reconsidered your remarks, or they were taken out of context somehow. I'm wondering how you feel about pedestrians - is it their own fault when they get hit crossing the street, since roads are 'for buses, cars, and trucks.'? Does the Heart and Stroke Foundation know your position, since they're encouraging people to walk and bike as part of their daily routine? Bicyclists and pedestrians have as much right to the roads as automobile drivers. Roads are for people, not just people in cars. People who choose an less polluting, healthier option for transportation shouldn't be told that it's their fault when they get hit by a speeder, or drunk or careless driver. I hope you and your office will publicly retract your statement and issue one that acknowledges bicyclists' and pedestrians' rights to use the road. Sincerely, Kathy Keehan ----------------------------------------------- Kathy Keehan Executive Director San Diego County Bicycle Coalition P.O. Box 34544 San Diego, CA 92163 858.487.6063 execdir at sdcbc.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.bikesandiego.org/pipermail/sdcbc/attachments/20070309/148441b9/attachment.html From execdir at sdcbc.org Fri Mar 9 15:46:58 2007 From: execdir at sdcbc.org (Kathy Keehan) Date: Fri, 9 Mar 2007 12:46:58 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] Ride and Learn - Don't forget the time change! Message-ID: <004301c7628c$150c0040$3f2400c0$@org> For those of you participating in the Ride and Learn on Sunday - don't forget that our clocks spring forward Sunday morning, and we'll be meeting at 9:15 Daylight Saving Time. J Kathy ----------------------------------------------- Kathy Keehan Executive Director San Diego County Bicycle Coalition P.O. Box 34544 San Diego, CA 92163 858.487.6063 execdir at sdcbc.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.bikesandiego.org/pipermail/sdcbc/attachments/20070309/e7c19825/attachment.html From bikes.alot at cox.net Fri Mar 9 22:08:24 2007 From: bikes.alot at cox.net (Bicyclist) Date: Fri, 09 Mar 2007 19:08:24 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] Fwd: San Diego Senior Olympics Bicyle Races Message-ID: <7.0.1.0.2.20070309190720.03596480@cox.net> For we, ahem, seniors. >Add it to your race calendar -- San Diego Senior Olympics, September 28- 30. > >The San Diego Senior Olympics have officially approved the bicycling >events for 2007. As with 2006, there will be five separate races at >four venues in three days: a ten mile time trial on the morning of >Friday, Sept. 28; a flying 200 meter sprint followed by a 2 >kilometer pursuit at the San Diego Velodrome in the afternoon and >early evening of Sept. 28; a ten mile hillclimb up the Sunrise >Highway (a Category 1 climb) on the morning of Saturday, Sept. >29; and a 20 kilometer criterium on the morning of Sunday, Sept 30. > >Racing is for Masters, men and women, aged 50 and above, separated >in 5 year age categories. As with last year, there will be separate >races for "New" and "Experienced" (USCF) riders. > >Race directing and announcing is by Ralph Elliott of MGE >Racing. The Sunday morning Senior Olympics criterium will be >followed by the USCF-permitted Endless Summer Criterium. Both the >Senior Olympics bike races and the Endless Summer Criterium are >presented by the San Diego Bicycle Club. > >Details are still being worked out. We'll send you a race flyer >after final arrangements have been made. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.bikesandiego.org/pipermail/sdcbc/attachments/20070309/cabfa35e/attachment.html From JonIsaacs at aol.com Sat Mar 10 16:41:47 2007 From: JonIsaacs at aol.com (JonIsaacs at aol.com) Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2007 16:41:47 EST Subject: [SDCBC] Cyclists Use Pedestrian Crossing??? Message-ID: Hi: I happened to driving in El Cajon this morning (Parts for the washing machine) I was west bound on Bradley and I noticed that at Cuyamca there was the following sign: CYCLISTS USE PEDESTRIAN CROSSING After having just played around making a wallet card with sections from CVC 21200 and 21202, this sign seems improper... Just wondering if such signs are "legal" ? Any thoughts comments appreciated. Jon ************************************** AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at http://www.aol.com. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.bikesandiego.org/pipermail/sdcbc/attachments/20070310/386bf292/attachment.html From stephanvance at cox.net Sat Mar 10 17:05:07 2007 From: stephanvance at cox.net (Stephan Vance) Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2007 14:05:07 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] Cyclists Use Pedestrian Crossing??? In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <000701c76360$2bac2260$54196b44@D9CXGJ41> I have seen the sign too, and as I recall, it is a rectangular black on white sign. That means it is meant to be a regulatory sign. However, it is not an approved sign in the Manual of Uniform Traffic Control Devices, nor does the Vehicle Code contain language specifying when such a provision would apply. That doesn't mean the El Cajon Police Department wouldn't try to enforce the sign, but I don't think SDCBC has ever heard of anyone being issued a citation there. Stephan Vance _____ From: sdcbc-bounces at bikesandiego.org [mailto:sdcbc-bounces at bikesandiego.org] On Behalf Of JonIsaacs at aol.com Sent: Saturday, March 10, 2007 1:42 PM To: SDCBC at bikesandiego.org Subject: [SDCBC] Cyclists Use Pedestrian Crossing??? Hi: I happened to driving in El Cajon this morning (Parts for the washing machine) I was west bound on Bradley and I noticed that at Cuyamca there was the following sign: CYCLISTS USE PEDESTRIAN CROSSING After having just played around making a wallet card with sections from CVC 21200 and 21202, this sign seems improper... Just wondering if such signs are "legal" ? Any thoughts comments appreciated. Jon ************************************** AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at http://www.aol.com. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.bikesandiego.org/pipermail/sdcbc/attachments/20070310/43f5dec0/attachment-0001.html From rob_leone at earthlink.net Sat Mar 10 18:38:15 2007 From: rob_leone at earthlink.net (Robert Leone) Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2007 15:38:15 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] More Sign Mischief! Pomerado Road northbound. Message-ID: <45F34167.6080101@earthlink.net> Dear SDCBCers: Hi! I don't recall whether this was within San Diego or Poway, but whilst riding on Pomerado Road northbound this AM I noticed a "WEAR A HELMET" sign underneath one of the no parking/bike lane double signs. I believe this was around the Twin Peaks Road intersection, but couldn't swear to it. Is that "legal" or are other safety suggestions on signs that small presented that bluntly? Robert Leone From JonIsaacs at aol.com Sat Mar 10 18:50:44 2007 From: JonIsaacs at aol.com (JonIsaacs at aol.com) Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2007 18:50:44 EST Subject: [SDCBC] More Sign Mischief! Pomerado Road northbound. Message-ID: In a message dated 3/10/07 3:38:38 PM Pacific Standard Time, rob_leone at earthlink.net writes: > Dear SDCBCers: > Hi! I don't recall whether this was within San Diego or Poway, but > whilst riding on Pomerado Road northbound this AM I noticed a "WEAR A > HELMET" sign underneath one of the no parking/bike lane double signs. ------ Is that a message meant for motorists??? Jon ************************************** AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at http://www.aol.com. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.bikesandiego.org/pipermail/sdcbc/attachments/20070310/07f74b75/attachment.html From sachiwilson at sbcglobal.net Sat Mar 10 19:01:04 2007 From: sachiwilson at sbcglobal.net (Sachi Wilson) Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2007 16:01:04 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] More Sign Mischief! Pomerado Road northbound. In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <7FDBE426-B441-4B5C-B878-AC24FD6A10A3@sbcglobal.net> On 10 Mar 2007, at 3:50 pm, JonIsaacs at aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 3/10/07 3:38:38 PM Pacific Standard Time, > rob_leone at earthlink.net writes: > >> Dear SDCBCers: >> Hi! I don't recall whether this was within San Diego or Poway, but >> whilst riding on Pomerado Road northbound this AM I noticed a "WEAR A >> HELMET" sign underneath one of the no parking/bike lane double signs. > > ------ > > Is that a message meant for motorists??? > > Jon Could it be meant for motorcyclists? That road is frequently used by motorcyclists who are heading for Ramona. FWIW my take on that sign is that it is an exhortation rather than some sort of misguided legal command. If it were a legal command it would typically say "All Bicyclists must wear a helmet." (Compare the signs at the border of California that tell motorcyclists entering from Arizona or Nevada that they must wear a helmet.) Sachi Wilson Law Office of Sachi T Wilson sachiwilson at sbcglobal.net From rob_leone at earthlink.net Sat Mar 10 19:34:32 2007 From: rob_leone at earthlink.net (Robert Leone) Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2007 16:34:32 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] Has anyone ever seen one of these? Message-ID: <45F34E98.6090002@earthlink.net> Dear SDCBCers: Hi! I was paging throught the traffic control device manual (thanks for the link!) and saw a "Begin Right Turn Lane: Yield to Bikes" sign over on page 9C-11 (Chapnter Nine is bike facility control). I don't recall EVER seeing one of those on any road anywhere in CA. Anybone? Buhler? Anyone? Robert From rob_leone at earthlink.net Sat Mar 10 19:42:52 2007 From: rob_leone at earthlink.net (Robert Leone) Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2007 16:42:52 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] Another sign -- one I'd not see even if it was there! Message-ID: <45F3508C.9060905@earthlink.net> Dear SDCBCers: Another sign I'd LOVE to see some of, although if they were there I wouldn't see them, now would I, is the red bike sihloette with "Wrong Way" above a white admonishment to "Ride With Traffic." We could use those all over the Pacific Beach business district. Robert Leone From bikes.alot at cox.net Sat Mar 10 19:44:41 2007 From: bikes.alot at cox.net (Bicyclist) Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2007 16:44:41 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] Cyclists Use Pedestrian Crossing??? In-Reply-To: <000701c76360$2bac2260$54196b44@D9CXGJ41> References: <000701c76360$2bac2260$54196b44@D9CXGJ41> Message-ID: <7.0.1.0.2.20070310164138.037f0630@cox.net> I'd accept a "Bicyclists May Use Pedestrian Crossing" sign, but not this one. Even if no one has been cited, the message to everyone, IMO, is that bicyclists don't belong off of the ped crossing... ripe for harassment from some. [Though it is apparently unclear under CVC whether it is legal to ride a bike in a crosswalk.] At 02:05 PM 3/10/2007, Stephan Vance wrote: >I have seen the sign too, and as I recall, it is a rectangular black >on white sign. That means it is meant to be a regulatory sign. >However, it is not an approved sign in the Manual of Uniform Traffic >Control Devices, nor does the Vehicle Code contain language >specifying when such a provision would apply. That doesn't mean the >El Cajon Police Department wouldn't try to enforce the sign, but I >don't think SDCBC has ever heard of anyone being issued a citation there. > >Stephan Vance > > >---------- >From: sdcbc-bounces at bikesandiego.org >[mailto:sdcbc-bounces at bikesandiego.org] On Behalf Of JonIsaacs at aol.com >Sent: Saturday, March 10, 2007 1:42 PM >To: SDCBC at bikesandiego.org >Subject: [SDCBC] Cyclists Use Pedestrian Crossing??? > >Hi: > >I happened to driving in El Cajon this morning (Parts for the >washing machine) I was west bound on Bradley and I noticed that at >Cuyamca there was the following sign: > >CYCLISTS USE PEDESTRIAN CROSSING > >After having just played around making a wallet card with sections >from CVC 21200 and 21202, this sign seems improper... > >Just wondering if such signs are "legal" ? Any thoughts comments appreciated. > >Jon > > > >************************************** >AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's >free from AOL at http://www.aol.com. >_______________________________________________ > >You are subscribed to the SDCBC mailing list as bikes.alot at cox.net >To unsubscribe or change mailing options, go to >http://www.bikesandiego.org/mailman/listinfo/sdcbc >List privacy information is located at http://www.stickman-computing.org/aup >For help or to talk with someone other than the mail robot, send >e-mail to postmaster at stickman-computing.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.bikesandiego.org/pipermail/sdcbc/attachments/20070310/7565b47b/attachment.html From JimBaross at cox.net Sat Mar 10 19:48:36 2007 From: JimBaross at cox.net (Jim Baross) Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2007 16:48:36 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] and pavement markings Re: Has anyone ever seen one of these? In-Reply-To: <45F34E98.6090002@earthlink.net> References: <45F34E98.6090002@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <7.0.1.0.2.20070310164625.0397cea0@cox.net> Especially galling to me is the apparent refusal of local district Caltrans to use the approved pavement markings, a little white stencil of a bike and rider, showing the "sweet spot" for positioning yourself to actuate a traffic signal! At 04:34 PM 3/10/2007, Robert Leone wrote: >Dear SDCBCers: > Hi! I was paging throught the traffic control device manual > (thanks for >the link!) and saw a "Begin Right Turn Lane: Yield to Bikes" sign over >on page 9C-11 (Chapnter Nine is bike facility control). I don't recall >EVER seeing one of those on any road anywhere in CA. Anybone? Buhler? >Anyone? > >Robert From JonIsaacs at aol.com Sat Mar 10 20:09:06 2007 From: JonIsaacs at aol.com (JonIsaacs at aol.com) Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2007 20:09:06 EST Subject: [SDCBC] and pavement markings Re: Has anyone ever seen one of these? Message-ID: In a message dated 3/10/07 4:53:41 PM Pacific Standard Time, JimBaross at cox.net writes: > Especially galling to me is the apparent refusal of local district > Caltrans to use the approved pavement markings, a little white > stencil of a bike and rider, showing the "sweet spot" for > positioning yourself to actuate a traffic signal! > ------- One of my dreams is that one day all the bicyclists in San Diego will report each and every traffic sensor that is broken (ie does not respond to a bicycle, including those that are not marked) and if it happens a second time, report each incident to the appropriate city council member. It would be a significant effort but one that could not long be ignored. Just dreaming away... Jon Jon ************************************** AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at http://www.aol.com. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.bikesandiego.org/pipermail/sdcbc/attachments/20070310/0d5071a5/attachment.html From j.eldon at sbcglobal.net Sat Mar 10 20:41:56 2007 From: j.eldon at sbcglobal.net (John Eldon) Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2007 17:41:56 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] reporting nonresponsive traffic signal loop detectors In-Reply-To: Message-ID: As I have reported previously, I have had very good response from the City of Carlsbad when reporting nonresponsive loop detectors, and I am batting a bit over .500 with the City of Encinitas. Perhaps they have more enlightened traffic engineering departments than elsewhere, or perhaps my having a Carlsbad business address and an Encinitas residence gives me a little more clout in those cities. If you get nowhere with the traffic engineering department, start working on the respective City Council or County Board of Supers. John E. -----Original Message----- From: sdcbc-bounces at bikesandiego.org [mailto:sdcbc-bounces at bikesandiego.org]On Behalf Of JonIsaacs at aol.com One of my dreams is that one day all the bicyclists in San Diego will report each and every traffic sensor that is broken (ie does not respond to a bicycle, including those that are not marked) and if it happens a second time, report each incident to the appropriate city council member. It would be a significant effort but one that could not long be ignored. Just dreaming away... Jon -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.bikesandiego.org/pipermail/sdcbc/attachments/20070310/1d6dd41a/attachment-0001.html From JonIsaacs at aol.com Sat Mar 10 21:49:56 2007 From: JonIsaacs at aol.com (JonIsaacs at aol.com) Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2007 21:49:56 EST Subject: [SDCBC] reporting nonresponsive traffic signal loop detectors Message-ID: In a message dated 3/10/07 5:49:23 PM Pacific Standard Time, j.eldon at sbcglobal.net writes: > As I have reported previously, I have had very good response from the City > of Carlsbad when reporting nonresponsive loop detectors, and I am batting a > bit over .500 with the City of Encinitas. ==== John: I think this problem to big for one rider... The issue of not marking the sensors for cyclists apparently is city policy. In my view, the only way to affect that policy is a group effort of such a magnitude that the city is forced into making the sensors more bicycle friendly. Jon ************************************** AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at http://www.aol.com. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.bikesandiego.org/pipermail/sdcbc/attachments/20070310/75e9926d/attachment.html From gcarman at san.rr.com Sat Mar 10 22:12:06 2007 From: gcarman at san.rr.com (Gene Carman) Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2007 19:12:06 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] reporting nonresponsive traffic signal loop detectors In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <200703110317.l2B3H8kO009439@ms-smtp-04.socal.rr.com> The not marking thing is just part of the overall "sensitivity" the city has toward cyclists. In in my area, Clairemont Mesa, there are sensors so old that they are overlaid with other sensors, making it quite difficult to determine which is the right sensor pattern... if the pattern is visible at all. At 06:49 PM 3/10/2007, JonIsaacs at aol.com wrote: >In a message dated 3/10/07 5:49:23 PM Pacific Standard Time, >j.eldon at sbcglobal.net writes: > >>As I have reported previously, I have had very good response from >>the City of Carlsbad when reporting nonresponsive loop detectors, >>and I am batting a bit over .500 with the City of Encinitas. > >==== > >John: > >I think this problem to big for one rider... The issue of not >marking the sensors for cyclists apparently is city policy. In my >view, the only way to affect that policy is a group effort of such a >magnitude that the city is forced into making the sensors more >bicycle friendly. > >Jon > > > >************************************** >AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's >free from AOL at http://www.aol.com. >_______________________________________________ > >You are subscribed to the SDCBC mailing list as gcarman at san.rr.com >To unsubscribe or change mailing options, go to >http://www.bikesandiego.org/mailman/listinfo/sdcbc >List privacy information is located at http://www.stickman-computing.org/aup >For help or to talk with someone other than the mail robot, send >e-mail to postmaster at stickman-computing.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.bikesandiego.org/pipermail/sdcbc/attachments/20070310/f6e18f0f/attachment.html From pje at efgh.com Sat Mar 10 23:05:27 2007 From: pje at efgh.com (Philip Erdelsky) Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2007 20:05:27 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] Texas Street Bike Lane Message-ID: <45F38007.6080904@efgh.com> The bike lane on northbound Texas St. just north of Madison Ave. has been widened, but sometimes you still have to take the lane: http://www.efgh.com/temp/28535.jpg -- Philip Erdelsky :-) From rob_leone at earthlink.net Sat Mar 10 23:40:02 2007 From: rob_leone at earthlink.net (Robert Leone) Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2007 20:40:02 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] and pavement markings Re: Has anyone ever seen one of these? In-Reply-To: <7.0.1.0.2.20070310164625.0397cea0@cox.net> References: <45F34E98.6090002@earthlink.net> <7.0.1.0.2.20070310164625.0397cea0@cox.net> Message-ID: <45F38822.4000208@earthlink.net> Dear Mr. Baross: I wonder what Bob James over at CalTrans (bob_james at dot.ca.gov) would say about that. By the way, I was absolutely unable to evaluate any state of repairs on SR-76 between Fallbrook and Bonesall because my group ride leader last week hates SR--76 with a vehemence unparalleled in my prevous experience with folks with grudges against asphault. We ended up taking Olive Freaking Hill (don't you just hate it when you're going downhill at 20 mph on a bike and the biggest thing you can see in your face is a speed limit 10 mph sign?) instead, becuase he doesn't care to test to see if promised remediation has, in fact, been made. Guy hates it even worse than I hate the Old Highway 80 shoulder between Acorn and Jacumba that busted my rear wheel. Robert Leone Jim Baross wrote: > Especially galling to me is the apparent refusal of local district > Caltrans to use the approved pavement markings, a little white > stencil of a bike and rider, showing the "sweet spot" for > positioning yourself to actuate a traffic signal! > > At 04:34 PM 3/10/2007, Robert Leone wrote: > >>Dear SDCBCers: >> Hi! I was paging throught the traffic control device manual >>(thanks for >>the link!) and saw a "Begin Right Turn Lane: Yield to Bikes" sign over >>on page 9C-11 (Chapnter Nine is bike facility control). I don't recall >>EVER seeing one of those on any road anywhere in CA. Anybone? Buhler? >>Anyone? >> >>Robert > > From rob_leone at earthlink.net Sat Mar 10 23:44:18 2007 From: rob_leone at earthlink.net (Robert Leone) Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2007 20:44:18 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] reporting nonresponsive traffic signal loop detectors In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <45F38922.7000203@earthlink.net> Dear Jon: Do you have a nominee for an e-mail box flooding campaign? I'm in district 2 here -- I've voted for Frye about four times and she's not even my councilcritter any more..... Robert Leone JonIsaacs at aol.com wrote: > In a message dated 3/10/07 5:49:23 PM Pacific Standard Time, > j.eldon at sbcglobal.net writes: > >> As I have reported previously, I have had very good response from the >> City of Carlsbad when reporting nonresponsive loop detectors, and I am >> batting a bit over .500 with the City of Encinitas. > > > ==== > > John: > > I think this problem to big for one rider... The issue of not marking > the sensors for cyclists apparently is city policy. In my view, the > only way to affect that policy is a group effort of such a magnitude > that the city is forced into making the sensors more bicycle friendly. > > Jon > > > > ************************************** > AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free > from AOL at http://www.aol.com. > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > > You are subscribed to the SDCBC mailing list as rob_leone at earthlink.net > To unsubscribe or change mailing options, go to http://www.bikesandiego.org/mailman/listinfo/sdcbc > List privacy information is located at http://www.stickman-computing.org/aup > For help or to talk with someone other than the mail robot, send e-mail to postmaster at stickman-computing.org From JonIsaacs at aol.com Sun Mar 11 00:21:22 2007 From: JonIsaacs at aol.com (JonIsaacs at aol.com) Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2007 00:21:22 EST Subject: [SDCBC] reporting nonresponsive traffic signal loop detectors Message-ID: In a message dated 3/10/07 8:45:09 PM Pacific Standard Time, rob_leone at earthlink.net writes: > Dear Jon: > Do you have a nominee for an e-mail box flooding campaign? I'm in > district 2 here -- I've voted for Frye about four times and she's not > even my councilcritter any more..... > > Robert Leone > ----- Rob: My thinking is that it starts with everyone just calling in every signal sensor they encounter that is unresponsive to bicycles and requesting a call back when it has been repaired. If it still unresponsive then it is time to call the council person. Most of my riding is in either Scott Peters district or Donna Frye's. Both have been responsive in the past. I ponder what Mike Aguirre's thoughts might be if he knew that the city was recalcitrant about making sure the sensors were responsive to bicycles and providing appropriate markings. Left turn lanes like the one at the top of Genesee south of 52 need to work, there is obviously some increased risk either waiting for a car to trigger signal or running the signal due to the disfunctional sensor... Jon ************************************** AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at http://www.aol.com. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.bikesandiego.org/pipermail/sdcbc/attachments/20070311/5d758687/attachment.html From JimBaross at cox.net Sun Mar 11 00:17:53 2007 From: JimBaross at cox.net (Jim Baross) Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2007 21:17:53 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] Texas Street Bike Lane In-Reply-To: <45F38007.6080904@efgh.com> References: <45F38007.6080904@efgh.com> Message-ID: <7.0.1.0.2.20070310211519.038bbeb0@cox.net> And be careful of the sections with less than 4' of pavement. I am not sure that the City is claiming this as a Bike Lane any more since it seems to not meet required standards and has no pavement stencil but one I believe for it's whole length. The only sign I remember is one about "no parking bike lane" but no bike lane sign. Or did I miss 'em? At 08:05 PM 3/10/2007, Philip Erdelsky wrote: >The bike lane on northbound Texas St. just north of Madison Ave. >has been widened, but sometimes you still have to take the lane: > > http://www.efgh.com/temp/28535.jpg > >-- Philip Erdelsky > >:-) From JimBaross at cox.net Sun Mar 11 00:18:56 2007 From: JimBaross at cox.net (Jim Baross) Date: Sat, 10 Mar 2007 21:18:56 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] and pavement markings Re: Has anyone ever seen one of these? In-Reply-To: <45F38822.4000208@earthlink.net> References: <45F34E98.6090002@earthlink.net> <7.0.1.0.2.20070310164625.0397cea0@cox.net> <45F38822.4000208@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <7.0.1.0.2.20070310210423.0368f710@cox.net> Bob James rides a bike. He doesn't always get his way, who does. His paycheck comes from Caltrans. Our Caltrans District promised that video detection for actuating traffic signals would be installed at intersections that we complained about for several years. They first denied any need, then told me the pavement markings weren't allowable. When told by headquarters in Sacramento that the markings were allowed, they failed to purchase the stencils... more delay... then a year of so ago made the video detection plan. I haven't seen any movement yet to install detection. :-( I fully believe that those able to make the decision think that the allowable stencil/pavement marking will encourage people on bikes to use it; to move over into the traffic lane and thereby become "in the way" of motor vehicles. At 09:03 PM 3/10/2007, Robert Leone wrote: Dear Mr. Baross: I wonder what Bob James over at CalTrans (bob_james at dot.ca.gov) would say about that. Jim Baross wrote: > Especially galling to me is the apparent refusal of local district > Caltrans to use the approved pavement markings, a little white > stencil of a bike and rider, showing the "sweet spot" for > positioning yourself to actuate a traffic signal! > > At 04:34 PM 3/10/2007, Robert Leone wrote: > >>Dear SDCBCers: >> Hi! I was paging throught the traffic control device manual >>(thanks for >>the link!) and saw a "Begin Right Turn Lane: Yield to Bikes" sign over >>on page 9C-11 (Chapnter Nine is bike facility control). I don't recall >>EVER seeing one of those on any road anywhere in CA. Anybone? Buhler? >>Anyone? >> >>Robert From gcarman at san.rr.com Sun Mar 11 07:58:02 2007 From: gcarman at san.rr.com (Gene Carman) Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2007 03:58:02 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] While we are busy citing cvc21200 and cvc21202... In-Reply-To: <7.0.1.0.2.20070310210423.0368f710@cox.net> References: <45F34E98.6090002@earthlink.net> <7.0.1.0.2.20070310164625.0397cea0@cox.net> <45F38822.4000208@earthlink.net> <7.0.1.0.2.20070310210423.0368f710@cox.net> Message-ID: <200703111203.l2BC34Ce001138@ms-smtp-02.socal.rr.com> Has anyone noticed that part of cvc21200 cites cvc39000? http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d11/vc21200.htm 21200. (a) Every person riding a bicycle upon a highway has all the rights and is subject to all the provisions applicable to the driver of a vehicle by this division, including, but not limited to, provisions concerning driving under the influence of alcoholic beverages or drugs, and by Division 10 (commencing with Section 20000), Section 27400, Division 16.7 (commencing with Section 39000), Division 17 (commencing with Section 40000.1), and Division 18 (commencing with Section 42000), except those provisions which by their very nature can have no application. http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d16_7/vc39001.htm 39001. (a) The department shall procure and distribute bicycle license indicia and registration forms to all counties and cities which have adopted a bicycle licensing ordinance or resolution. Those counties and cities shall issue the indicia and registration form to the owner of any new bicycle, and may, upon request of the owner, issue an indicia and registration form to the owner of any bicycle which complies with Section 39007. The department shall charge and collect a fee, not to exceed the cost of procuring and distributing the license indicia and registration form, for each bicycle license indicia and registration form issued. All fees collected pursuant to this section shall be deposited in the Motor Vehicle Account in the State Transportation Fund. Those fees are hereby continuously appropriated from the account for use by the department to defray costs to procure and distribute the bicycle license indicia and registration forms. So what is San Diego's policy on license and registration of bicycles... assuming they have "adopted a bicycle licensing ordinance or resolution?" How many of us are in compliance with the local law, should we for instance be pulled over. If we are quick to cite cvc21200 and cvc21202, should we not also be in compliance with SDMC34.02? http://clerkdoc.sannet.gov/legtrain/mc/MuniCodeChapter03/Ch03Art04Division00 ?34.02 Bicycle License Required Except as provided by Section 34.09 of this article, it is unlawful for any person to operate a bicycle upon any public street, alley, sidewalk, highway, or other public property within the jurisdiction of The City of San Diego without first obtaining a license issued by said City. Bicycle retailers are authorized and directed to issue, upon written application, a bicycle license, to any person residing within the City of San Diego. Bicycle retailers issuing licenses will charge a fee pursuant to section 34.02. Fees collected in accordance with section 34.02 shall be sent to the San Diego Fire Department. Bicycle retailers will purchase bicycle licenses and stickers from the San Diego Fire Department. The San Diego Fire Department will return $1 of the $2 license fees collected to bicycle retailers upon return of a completed registration form. License applicants who reside outside the City of San Diego shall be referred to their respective city or jurisdiction of residency. Any bicycle not subject to the provisions of this article may be licensed upon the request of the owner. How many of you are in compliance? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.bikesandiego.org/pipermail/sdcbc/attachments/20070311/72d72249/attachment.html From public at exwis.com Sun Mar 11 08:45:42 2007 From: public at exwis.com (Fulton Martin) Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2007 05:45:42 -0700 Subject: [SDCBC] While we are busy citing cvc21200 and cvc21202... In-Reply-To: <200703111203.l2BC34Ce001138@ms-smtp-02.socal.rr.com> References: <45F34E98.6090002@earthlink.net> <7.0.1.0.2.20070310164625.0397cea0@cox.net> <45F38822.4000208@earthlink.net> <7.0.1.0.2.20070310210423.0368f710@cox.net> <200703111203.l2BC34Ce001138@ms-smtp-02.socal.rr.com> Message-ID: <45F3F9F6.2080505@exwis.com> I used to register my bicycles regularly, every two (?) years, until I got my first recumbent and went to the local fire station, where I was told they wouldn't be doing it anymore. I don't recall them saying the function was being transferred to retailers, but could be... Even *if* retailers are doing it, how willing are they to register a bicycle "upon the request of the owner" if the bicycle wasn't purchased at their shop? (Bought my last one out-of-state.) Gene Carman wrote: > Has anyone noticed that part of cvc21200 cites cvc39000? > > http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d11/vc21200.htm > > 21200. (a) Every person riding a bicycle upon a highway has all the > rights and is subject to all the provisions applicable to the driver of > a vehicle by this division, including, but not limited to, provisions > concerning driving under the influence of alcoholic beverages or drugs, > and by Division 10 (commencing with Section 20000), Section 27400, > Division 16.7 (*commencing with Section 39000*), Division 17 (commencing > with Section 40000.1), and Division 18 (commencing with Section 42000), > except those provisions which by their very nature can have no application. > > > http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d16_7/vc39001.htm > > 39001. (a) The department shall procure and distribute bicycle license > indicia and registration forms to all counties and cities which have > adopted a bicycle licensing ordinance or resolution. Those counties and > cities shall issue the indicia and registration form to the owner of any > new bicycle, and may, upon request of the owner, issue an indicia and > registration form to the owner of any bicycle which complies with > Section 39007. > > The department shall charge and collect a fee, not to exceed the cost of > procuring and distributing the license indicia and registration form, > for each bicycle license indicia and registration form issued. All fees > collected pursuant to this section shall be deposited in the Motor > Vehicle Account in the State Transportation Fund. Those fees are hereby > continuously appropriated from the account for use by the department to > defray costs to procure and distribute the bicycle license indicia and > registration forms. > > So what is San Diego's policy on license and registration of > bicycles... assuming they have "adopted a bicycle licensing ordinance > or resolution?" How many of us are in compliance with the local law, > should we for instance be pulled over. > > If we are quick to cite cvc21200 and cvc21202, should we not also be in > compliance with SDMC34.02? > > http://clerkdoc.sannet.gov/legtrain/mc/MuniCodeChapter03/Ch03Art04Division00 > > > *?34.02 Bicycle License Required > *Except as provided by Section 34.09 of this article, it is unlawful for > any person to > operate a bicycle upon any public street, alley, sidewalk, highway, or > other public > property within the jurisdiction of The City of San Diego without first > obtaining a > license issued by said City. Bicycle retailers are authorized and > directed to issue, > upon written application, a bicycle license, to any person residing > within the City of > San Diego. Bicycle retailers issuing licenses will charge a fee pursuant > to section > 34.02. Fees collected in accordance with section 34.02 shall be sent to > the San Diego > Fire Department. *Bicycle retailers will purchase bicycle licenses and > stickers from the > San Diego Fire Department.* The San Diego Fire Department will return $1 > of the $2 > license fees collected to bicycle retailers upon return of a completed > registration > form. License applicants who reside outside the City of San Diego shall > be referred to > their respective city or jurisdiction of residency. Any bicycle not > subject to the > provisions of this article may be licensed upon the request of the owner. > > How many of you are in compliance? > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > > You are subscribed to the SDCBC mailing list as public at exwis.com > To unsubscribe or change mailing options, go to http://www.bikesandiego.org/mailman/listinfo/sdcbc > List privacy information is located at http://www.stickman-computing.org/aup > For help or to talk with someone other than the mail robot, send e-mail to postmaster at stickman-computing.org -- Fulton Martin __=o&o>__ public at exwis.com San Diego, CA N32 43.956, W117 05.874 From JonIsaacs at aol.com Sun Mar 11 09:10:10 2007 From: JonIsaacs at aol.com (JonIsaacs at aol.com) Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2007 09:10:10 EDT Subject: [SDCBC] While we are busy citing cvc21200 and cvc21202... Message-ID: In a message dated 3/11/07 4:07:15 AM Pacific Standard Time, gcarman at san.rr.com writes: > . > > >>How many of you are in compliance? I have one that is licensed... I need a licensed bike in order to belong to the UCSD Pedal club and get the various benefits. Jon ************************************** AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at http://www.aol.com. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.bikesandiego.org/pipermail/sdcbc/attachments/20070311/90fb1ebf/attachment.html From j.eldon at sbcglobal.net Sun Mar 11 09:59:38 2007 From: j.eldon at sbcglobal.net (John Eldon) Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2007 06:59:38 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [SDCBC] and pavement markings Re: Has anyone ever seen one of these? Message-ID: <836075.67923.qm@web52510.mail.yahoo.com> We DO have at least one local precedent for the marking of traffic loop sweet spots. In the mid-to-late 1990s, during San Diego Northern Railroad's "Big Dig" track lowering exercise, northbound bicyclists were encouraged to bypass construction-constricted Coast Highway 101 from Via de la Valle to Solana Vista Dr. White-paint bicycle symbols depicted the sweet spots for the detour's two left turns, Coast Highway to Via de la Valle and Solana Vista back to the Coast Highway. Yes, I would strongly support such markings in general. John E. Jim Baross wrote: > Especially galling to me is the apparent refusal of local district > Caltrans to use the approved pavement markings, a little white > stencil of a bike and rider, showing the "sweet spot" for > positioning yourself to actuate a traffic signal! -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.bikesandiego.org/pipermail/sdcbc/attachments/20070311/9d09196c/attachment.html From j.eldon at sbcglobal.net Sun Mar 11 10:06:00 2007 From: j.eldon at sbcglobal.net (John Eldon) Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2007 07:06:00 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [SDCBC] While we are busy citing cvc21200 and cvc21202... Message-ID: <840753.11283.qm@web52514.mail.yahoo.com> I still have an expires-in-1976 Los Angeles Bike Licence sticker on my 1970 Peugeot UO-8. My 1960 Capo has an early 1960s San Diego bicycle license which some bureaucrat plastered right over the Reynolds 531 decal! From what I have seen on the Internet, mine is not an isolated instance. John E. ----- Original Message ---- From: "JonIsaacs at aol.com" To: sdcbc at bikesandiego.org Sent: Sunday, March 11, 2007 6:10:10 AM Subject: Re: [SDCBC] While we are busy citing cvc21200 and cvc21202... In a message dated 3/11/07 4:07:15 AM Pacific Standard Time, gcarman at san.rr.com writes: . >>How many of you are in compliance? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.bikesandiego.org/pipermail/sdcbc/attachments/20070311/77f06a5f/attachment.html From serge at issakov.org Sun Mar 11 11:12:56 2007 From: serge at issakov.org (Serge Issakov) Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2007 07:12:56 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] Texas Street Bike Lane In-Reply-To: <7.0.1.0.2.20070310211519.038bbeb0@cox.net> References: <45F38007.6080904@efgh.com> <7.0.1.0.2.20070310211519.038bbeb0@cox.net> Message-ID: <69ec985b0703110812s481098f3g31607277cf7a1e39@mail.gmail.com> Despite the recent widening, is it 4' or more wide at any section? On 3/10/07, Jim Baross wrote: > And be careful of the sections with less than 4' of pavement. > I am not sure that the City is claiming this as a Bike Lane any more > since it seems to not meet required standards and has no pavement > stencil but one I believe for it's whole length. The only sign I > remember is one about "no parking bike lane" but no bike lane sign. > Or did I miss 'em? > > At 08:05 PM 3/10/2007, Philip Erdelsky wrote: > >The bike lane on northbound Texas St. just north of Madison Ave. > >has been widened, but sometimes you still have to take the lane: > > > > http://www.efgh.com/temp/28535.jpg > > > >-- Philip Erdelsky > > > >:-) > > > > _______________________________________________ > > You are subscribed to the SDCBC mailing list as serge at issakov.org > To unsubscribe or change mailing options, go to http://www.bikesandiego.org/mailman/listinfo/sdcbc > List privacy information is located at http://www.stickman-computing.org/aup > For help or to talk with someone other than the mail robot, send e-mail to postmaster at stickman-computing.org > From execdir at sdcbc.org Sun Mar 11 17:46:48 2007 From: execdir at sdcbc.org (Kathy Keehan) Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2007 14:46:48 -0700 Subject: [SDCBC] FW: NO volunteer night this week Message-ID: <000b01c76426$c5477d40$4fd677c0$@org> From: Kathy Keehan [mailto:execdir at sdcbc.org] Sent: Sunday, March 11, 2007 2:46 PM To: Sdcbc (sdcbc at bikesandiego.org) Subject: NO volunteer night this week Hello all, Because so many people have renewed at the Coalition in such a timely manner, we don't have enough work for people to do on volunteer night! So you've all got the evening off. Please spread the word. Thanks! Kathy ----------------------------------------------- Kathy Keehan Executive Director San Diego County Bicycle Coalition P.O. Box 34544 San Diego, CA 92163 858.487.6063 execdir at sdcbc.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.bikesandiego.org/pipermail/sdcbc/attachments/20070311/b9dd8583/attachment.html From zpcallahan at wildmail.com Sun Mar 11 19:32:18 2007 From: zpcallahan at wildmail.com (Pauline Callahan) Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2007 16:32:18 -0700 Subject: [SDCBC] While we are busy citing cvc21200 and cvc21202... Message-ID: <356D33626F4FC2643986F98964F801AA@zpcallahan.wildmail.com> I just had a conversation with a cyclist who said he went to several bike shops and they didn't have the rigistration forms. He said he ended up in Pacific Baech somewhere. Action Cyclery in Scripts Ranch/Mira Mesa area has registrations available. Also, there is a "bike fix" community outreach going on next Saturday, March 17 in Tierra Santa (I don't have the exact address, but it is at a church on Tierra Santa Blvd and there are signs) and they will register your bike for free. ---- Begin Original Message ---- From: Fulton Martin Sent: Sun, 11 Mar 2007 05:45:42 -0700 To: sdcbc at bikesandiego.org Subject: Re: [SDCBC] While we are busy citing cvc21200 and cvc21202... I used to register my bicycles regularly, every two (?) years, until I got my first recumbent and went to the local fire station, where I was told they wouldn't be doing it anymore. I don't recall them saying the function was being transferred to retailers, but could be... Even *if* retailers are doing it, how willing are they to register a bicycle "upon the request of the owner" if the bicycle wasn't purchased at their shop? (Bought my last one out-of-state.) Gene Carman wrote: > Has anyone noticed that part of cvc21200 cites cvc39000? > > http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d11/vc21200.htm > > 21200. ? (a) Every person riding a bicycle upon a highway has all the > rights and is subject to all the provisions applicable to the driver of > a vehicle by this division, including, but not limited to, provisions > concerning driving under the influence of alcoholic beverages or drugs, > and by Division 10 (commencing with Section 20000), Section 27400, > Division 16.7 (*commencing with Section 39000*), Division 17 (commencing > with Section 40000.1), and Division 18 (commencing with Section 42000), > except those provisions which by their very nature can have no application. > > > http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d16_7/vc39001.htm > > 39001. ? (a) The department shall procure and distribute bicycle license > indicia and registration forms to all counties and cities which have > adopted a bicycle licensing ordinance or resolution. Those counties and > cities shall issue the indicia and registration form to the owner of any > new bicycle, and may, upon request of the owner, issue an indicia and > registration form to the owner of any bicycle which complies with > Section 39007. > > The department shall charge and collect a fee, not to exceed the cost of > procuring and distributing the license indicia and registration form, > for each bicycle license indicia and registration form issued. All fees > collected pursuant to this section shall be deposited in the Motor > Vehicle Account in the State Transportation Fund. Those fees are hereby > continuously appropriated from the account for use by the department to > defray costs to procure and distribute the bicycle license indicia and > registration forms. > > So what is San Diego's policy on license and registration of > bicycles... ?assuming they have "adopted a bicycle licensing ordinance > or resolution?" ?How many of us are in compliance with the local law, > should we for instance be pulled over. > > If we are quick to cite cvc21200 and cvc21202, should we not also be in > compliance with SDMC34.02? > > http://clerkdoc.sannet.gov/legtrain/mc/MuniCodeChapter03/Ch03Art04Division00 > > > *?34.02 Bicycle License Required > *Except as provided by Section 34.09 of this article, it is unlawful for > any person to > operate a bicycle upon any public street, alley, sidewalk, highway, or > other public > property within the jurisdiction of The City of San Diego without first > obtaining a > license issued by said City. Bicycle retailers are authorized and > directed to issue, > upon written application, a bicycle license, to any person residing > within the City of > San Diego. Bicycle retailers issuing licenses will charge a fee pursuant > to section > 34.02. Fees collected in accordance with section 34.02 shall be sent to > the San Diego > Fire Department. *Bicycle retailers will purchase bicycle licenses and > stickers from the > San Diego Fire Department.* The San Diego Fire Department will return $1 > of the $2 > license fees collected to bicycle retailers upon return of a completed > registration > form. License applicants who reside outside the City of San Diego shall > be referred to > their respective city or jurisdiction of residency. Any bicycle not > subject to the > provisions of this article may be licensed upon the request of the owner. > > How many of you are in compliance? > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > > You are subscribed to the SDCBC mailing list as public at exwis.com > To unsubscribe or change mailing options, go to http://www.bikesandiego.org/mailman/listinfo/sdcbc > List privacy information is located at http://www.stickman-computing.org/aup > For help or to talk with someone other than the mail robot, send e-mail to postmaster at stickman-computing.org -- Fulton Martin __=o&o>__ public at exwis.com San Diego, CA N32 43.956, W117 05.874 _______________________________________________ You are subscribed to the SDCBC mailing list as zpcallahan at wildmail.com To unsubscribe or change mailing options, go to http://www.bikesandiego.org/mailman/listinfo/sdcbc List privacy information is located at http://www.stickman-computing.org/aup For help or to talk with someone other than the mail robot, send e-mail to postmaster at stickman-computing.org ---- End Original Message ---- Don't sweat the petty things and don't pet the sweaty things! Stop the Forest Service from killing more wolves, bears, cougars, and other animals in the wild: http://go.care2.com/99055 http://www.Care2.com Free e-mail. 100MB storage. Helps nonprofits. From mberry2 at cox.net Sun Mar 11 19:43:27 2007 From: mberry2 at cox.net (Mike Berry) Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2007 16:43:27 -0700 Subject: [SDCBC] While we are busy citing cvc21200 and cvc21202... In-Reply-To: <356D33626F4FC2643986F98964F801AA@zpcallahan.wildmail.com> References: <356D33626F4FC2643986F98964F801AA@zpcallahan.wildmail.com> Message-ID: <002201c76437$10d4d130$6801a8c0@DC7JW2C1> Not to be flippant or otherwise disrespectful, but why should I bother? Mike Berry www.sandiegocenturyriders.com Home of the San Diego Brevet Series Dedicated to the Adventure and Camaraderie of Long Distance Cycling -----Original Message----- From: sdcbc-bounces at bikesandiego.org [mailto:sdcbc-bounces at bikesandiego.org] On Behalf Of Pauline Callahan Sent: Sunday, March 11, 2007 4:32 PM To: fulton at exwis.com; sdcbc at bikesandiego.org Subject: Re: [SDCBC] While we are busy citing cvc21200 and cvc21202... I just had a conversation with a cyclist who said he went to several bike shops and they didn't have the rigistration forms. He said he ended up in Pacific Baech somewhere. Action Cyclery in Scripts Ranch/Mira Mesa area has registrations available. Also, there is a "bike fix" community outreach going on next Saturday, March 17 in Tierra Santa (I don't have the exact address, but it is at a church on Tierra Santa Blvd and there are signs) and they will register your bike for free. ---- Begin Original Message ---- From: Fulton Martin Sent: Sun, 11 Mar 2007 05:45:42 -0700 To: sdcbc at bikesandiego.org Subject: Re: [SDCBC] While we are busy citing cvc21200 and cvc21202... I used to register my bicycles regularly, every two (?) years, until I got my first recumbent and went to the local fire station, where I was told they wouldn't be doing it anymore. I don't recall them saying the function was being transferred to retailers, but could be... Even *if* retailers are doing it, how willing are they to register a bicycle "upon the request of the owner" if the bicycle wasn't purchased at their shop? (Bought my last one out-of-state.) Gene Carman wrote: > Has anyone noticed that part of cvc21200 cites cvc39000? > > http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d11/vc21200.htm > > 21200. ? (a) Every person riding a bicycle upon a highway has all the > rights and is subject to all the provisions applicable to the driver of > a vehicle by this division, including, but not limited to, provisions > concerning driving under the influence of alcoholic beverages or drugs, > and by Division 10 (commencing with Section 20000), Section 27400, > Division 16.7 (*commencing with Section 39000*), Division 17 (commencing > with Section 40000.1), and Division 18 (commencing with Section 42000), > except those provisions which by their very nature can have no application. > > > http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d16_7/vc39001.htm > > 39001. ? (a) The department shall procure and distribute bicycle license > indicia and registration forms to all counties and cities which have > adopted a bicycle licensing ordinance or resolution. Those counties and > cities shall issue the indicia and registration form to the owner of any > new bicycle, and may, upon request of the owner, issue an indicia and > registration form to the owner of any bicycle which complies with > Section 39007. > > The department shall charge and collect a fee, not to exceed the cost of > procuring and distributing the license indicia and registration form, > for each bicycle license indicia and registration form issued. All fees > collected pursuant to this section shall be deposited in the Motor > Vehicle Account in the State Transportation Fund. Those fees are hereby > continuously appropriated from the account for use by the department to > defray costs to procure and distribute the bicycle license indicia and > registration forms. > > So what is San Diego's policy on license and registration of > bicycles... ?assuming they have "adopted a bicycle licensing ordinance > or resolution?" ?How many of us are in compliance with the local law, > should we for instance be pulled over. > > If we are quick to cite cvc21200 and cvc21202, should we not also be in > compliance with SDMC34.02? > > http://clerkdoc.sannet.gov/legtrain/mc/MuniCodeChapter03/Ch03Art04Division00 > > > *?34.02 Bicycle License Required > *Except as provided by Section 34.09 of this article, it is unlawful for > any person to > operate a bicycle upon any public street, alley, sidewalk, highway, or > other public > property within the jurisdiction of The City of San Diego without first > obtaining a > license issued by said City. Bicycle retailers are authorized and > directed to issue, > upon written application, a bicycle license, to any person residing > within the City of > San Diego. Bicycle retailers issuing licenses will charge a fee pursuant > to section > 34.02. Fees collected in accordance with section 34.02 shall be sent to > the San Diego > Fire Department. *Bicycle retailers will purchase bicycle licenses and > stickers from the > San Diego Fire Department.* The San Diego Fire Department will return $1 > of the $2 > license fees collected to bicycle retailers upon return of a completed > registration > form. License applicants who reside outside the City of San Diego shall > be referred to > their respective city or jurisdiction of residency. Any bicycle not > subject to the > provisions of this article may be licensed upon the request of the owner. > > How many of you are in compliance? > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > _______________________________________________ > > You are subscribed to the SDCBC mailing list as public at exwis.com > To unsubscribe or change mailing options, go to http://www.bikesandiego.org/mailman/listinfo/sdcbc > List privacy information is located at http://www.stickman-computing.org/aup > For help or to talk with someone other than the mail robot, send e-mail to postmaster at stickman-computing.org -- Fulton Martin __=o&o>__ public at exwis.com San Diego, CA N32 43.956, W117 05.874 _______________________________________________ You are subscribed to the SDCBC mailing list as zpcallahan at wildmail.com To unsubscribe or change mailing options, go to http://www.bikesandiego.org/mailman/listinfo/sdcbc List privacy information is located at http://www.stickman-computing.org/aup For help or to talk with someone other than the mail robot, send e-mail to postmaster at stickman-computing.org ---- End Original Message ---- Don't sweat the petty things and don't pet the sweaty things! Stop the Forest Service from killing more wolves, bears, cougars, and other animals in the wild: http://go.care2.com/99055 http://www.Care2.com Free e-mail. 100MB storage. Helps nonprofits. _______________________________________________ You are subscribed to the SDCBC mailing list as mberry2 at cox.net To unsubscribe or change mailing options, go to http://www.bikesandiego.org/mailman/listinfo/sdcbc List privacy information is located at http://www.stickman-computing.org/aup For help or to talk with someone other than the mail robot, send e-mail to postmaster at stickman-computing.org From gcarman at san.rr.com Mon Mar 12 00:47:24 2007 From: gcarman at san.rr.com (Gene Carman) Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2007 20:47:24 -0800 Subject: [SDCBC] While we are busy citing cvc21200 and cvc21202... In-Reply-To: <002201c76437$10d4d130$6801a8c0@DC7JW2C1> References: <356D33626F4FC2643986F98964F801AA@zpcallahan.wildmail.com> <002201c76437$10d4d130$6801a8c0@DC7JW2C1> Message-ID: <200703120347.l2C3lYr8024863@ms-smtp-01.socal.rr.com> Only to be completely legal in the face of a rights battle. I'll give you an example: The other day I was riding on a 35MPH road where there are cars parked along the side and there are no alternative routes, due to the configuration of canyons in the area. As I rode down that road, taking the right lane of the two going each way, a fair number of motorists in their cars had no trouble passing me to the left. There were a few however that seemed perplexed by the concept of a cyclist "in their way." Many of the cyclists in the area choose to be sidewalk riders, but at the 15-18MPH I was traveling, sidewalk riding did not seem very practical, and the law (as I cited) gives me rights to the road; to ride not along the curb, but out in the lane as I was doing, to avoid the cars along the right side, and their potential opening doors. So I got to thinking about a suitable slogan for the back of my T shirt... to "inform" those perplexed motorists. I thought of: CVC 21200 CVC 21202 Google it. Well later, I did google CVC21200, just like I had written above, and I realized that 21200 mentioned licensing, or really registration. I then thought about the consequences of an argument with a cop... who might fall back on the lack of license, as his point, to issue a ticket. Yeah, a bit convoluted, but I realized that indeed, I am riding in violation of a law and dammit, my argument would fall on deaf ears at that point. At 03:43 PM 3/11/2007, Mike Berry wrote: >Not to be flippant or otherwise disrespectful, but why should I bother? > >Mike Berry >www.sandiegocenturyriders.com >Home of the San Diego Brevet Series >Dedicated to the Adventure and Camaraderie > of Long Distance Cycling > > >-----Original Message----- >From: sdcbc-bounces at bikesandiego.org [mailto:sdcbc-bounces at bikesandiego.org] >On Behalf Of Pauline Callahan >Sent: Sunday, March 11, 2007 4:32 PM >To: fulton at exwis.com; sdcbc at bikesandiego.org >Subject: Re: [SDCBC] While we are busy citing cvc21200 and cvc21202... > >I just had a conversation with a cyclist who said he went to several bike >shops and they didn't have the rigistration forms. He said he ended up in >Pacific Baech somewhere. Action Cyclery in Scripts Ranch/Mira Mesa area has >registrations available. Also, there is a "bike fix" community outreach >going on next Saturday, March 17 in Tierra Santa (I don't have the exact >address, but it is at a church on Tierra Santa Blvd and there are signs) and >they will register your bike for free. > > >---- Begin Original Message ---- > From: Fulton Martin >Sent: Sun, 11 Mar 2007 05:45:42 -0700 >To: sdcbc at bikesandiego.org >Subject: Re: [SDCBC] While we are busy citing cvc21200 and cvc21202... > >I used to register my bicycles regularly, every two (?) years, until I >got my first recumbent and went to the local fire station, where I was >told they wouldn't be doing it anymore. I don't recall them saying the >function was being transferred to retailers, but could be... > >Even *if* retailers are doing it, how willing are they to register a >bicycle "upon the request of the owner" if the bicycle wasn't purchased >at their shop? (Bought my last one out-of-state.) > >Gene Carman wrote: > > Has anyone noticed that part of cvc21200 cites cvc39000? > > > > http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d11/vc21200.htm > > > > 21200. (a) Every person riding a bicycle upon a highway has all the > > rights and is subject to all the provisions applicable to the driver of > > a vehicle by this division, including, but not limited to, provisions > > concerning driving under the influence of alcoholic beverages or drugs, > > and by Division 10 (commencing with Section 20000), Section 27400, > > Division 16.7 (*commencing with Section 39000*), Division 17 (commencing > > with Section 40000.1), and Division 18 (commencing with Section 42000), > > except those provisions which by their very nature can have no >application. > > > > > > http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d16_7/vc39001.htm > > > > 39001. (a) The department shall procure and distribute bicycle license > > indicia and registration forms to all counties and cities which have > > adopted a bicycle licensing ordinance or resolution. Those counties and > > cities shall issue the indicia and registration form to the owner of any > > new bicycle, and may, upon request of the owner, issue an indicia and > > registration form to the owner of any bicycle which complies with > > Section 39007. > > > > The department shall charge and collect a fee, not to exceed the cost of > > procuring and distributing the license indicia and registration form, > > for each bicycle license indicia and registration form issued. All fees > > collected pursuant to this section shall be deposited in the Motor > > Vehicle Account in the State Transportation Fund. Those fees are hereby > > continuously appropriated from the account for use by the department to > > defray costs to procure and distribute the bicycle license indicia and > > registration forms. > > > > So what is San Diego's policy on license and registration of > > bicycles... assuming they have "adopted a bicycle licensing ordinance > > or resolution?" How many of us are in compliance with the local law, > > should we for instance be pulled over. > > > > If we are quick to cite cvc21200 and cvc21202, should we not also be in > > compliance with SDMC34.02? > > > > >http://clerkdoc.sannet.gov/legtrain/mc/MuniCodeChapter03/Ch03Art04Division00 > > > > > > > *?34.02 Bicycle License Required > > *Except as provided by Section 34.09 of this article, it is unlawful for > > any person to > > operate a bicycle upon any public street, alley, sidewalk, highway, or > > other public > > property within the jurisdiction of The City of San Diego without first > > obtaining a > > license issued by said City. Bicycle retailers are authorized and > > directed to issue, > > upon written application, a bicycle license, to any person residing > > within the City of > > San Diego. Bicycle retailers issuing licenses will charge a fee pursuant > > to section > > 34.02. Fees collected in accordance with section 34.02 shall be sent to > > the San Diego > > Fire Department. *Bicycle retailers will purchase bicycle licenses and > > stickers from the > > San Diego Fire Department.* The San Diego Fire Department will return $1 > > of the $2 > > license fees collected to bicycle retailers upon return of a completed > > registration > > form. License applicants who reside outside the City of San Diego shall > > be referred to > > their respective city or jurisdiction of residency. Any bicycle not > > subject to the > > provisions of this article may be licensed upon the request of the owner. > > > > How many of you are in compliance? > > > > > > ------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > > > _______________________________________________ > > > > You are subscribed to the SDCBC mailing list as public at exwis.com > > To unsubscribe or change mailing options, go to >http://www.bikesandiego.org/mailman/listinfo/sdcbc > > List privacy information is located at >http://www.stickman-computing.org/aup > > For help or to talk with someone other than the mail robot, send e-mail to >postmaster at stickman-computing.org > >-- >Fulton Martin >__=o&o>__ >public at exwis.com >San Diego, CA >N32 43.956, W117 05.874 >_______________________________________________ > >You are subscribed to the SDCBC mailing list as zpcallahan at wildmail.com >To unsubscribe or change mailing options, go to >http://www.bikesandiego.org/mailman/listinfo/sdcbc >List privacy information is located at http://www.stickman-computing.org/aup >For help or to talk with someone other than the mail robot, send e-mail to >postmaster at stickman-computing.org > >---- End Original Message ---- > > > >Don't sweat the petty things and don't pet the sweaty things! > >Stop the Forest Service from killing more wolves, bears, cougars, and other >animals in the wild: >http://go.care2.com/99055 > >http://www.Care2.com Free e-mail. 100MB storage. Helps nonprofits. >_______________________________________________ > >You are subscribed to the SDCBC mailing list as mberry2 at cox.net >To unsubscribe or change mailing options, go to >http://www.bikesandiego.org/mailman/listinfo/sdcbc >List privacy information is located at http://www.stickman-computing.org/aup >For help or to talk with someone other than the mail robot, send e-mail to >postmaster at stickman-computing.org > >_______________________________________________ > >You are subscribed to the SDCBC mailing list as gcarman at san.rr.com >To unsubscribe or change mailing options, go to >http://www.bikesandiego.org/mailman/listinfo/sdcbc >List privacy information is located at http://www.stickman-computing.org/aup >For help or to talk with someone other than the >mail robot, send e-mail to postmaster at stickman-computing.org -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.bikesandiego.org/pipermail/sdcbc/attachments/20070311/0e36fad0/attachment-0001.html From lists01 at briandesousa.com Mon Mar 12 00:47:13 2007 From: lists01 at briandesousa.com (Brian DeSousa) Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2007 21:47:13 -0700 Subject: [SDCBC] Has anyone ever seen one of these? In-Reply-To: <45F34E98.6090002@earthlink.net> References: <45F34E98.6090002@earthlink.net> Message-ID: <20070312045556.75CA5234B@uniblab.stickman-computing.org> At 05:34 PM 3/10/2007, Robert Leone wrote: > Hi! I was paging throught the traffic control device manual > (thanks for >the link!) and saw a "Begin Right Turn Lane: Yield to Bikes" sign over >on page 9C-11 (Chapnter Nine is bike facility control). I don't recall >EVER seeing one of those on any road anywhere in CA. Anybone? Buhler? >Anyone? I've seen a couple of them on a bike lane in Seal Beach, near Long Beach. Brian Orange, CA From j.eldon at sbcglobal.net Mon Mar 12 11:24:23 2007 From: j.eldon at sbcglobal.net (John Eldon) Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2007 08:24:23 -0700 (PDT) Subject: [SDCBC] While we are busy citing cvc21200 and cvc21202... Message-ID: <500868.33696.qm@web52513.mail.yahoo.com> To register a bike, I presume one needs to prove ownership. This could be tough for those of us who ride old bikes, as I do. (My bikes range in age from 19 to 48 years, and all but one were purchased in very used condition from private parties.) John E. ----- Original Message ---- From: Mike Berry To: sdcbc at bikesandiego.org Sent: Sunday, March 11, 2007 4:43:27 PM Subject: Re: [SDCBC] While we are busy citing cvc21200 and cvc21202... Not to be flippant or otherwise disrespectful, but why should I bother? Mike Berry www.sandiegocenturyriders.com Home of the San Diego Brevet Series Dedicated to the Adventure and Camaraderie of Long Distance Cycling -----Original Message----- From: sdcbc-bounces at bikesandiego.org [mailto:sdcbc-bounces at bikesandiego.org] On Behalf Of Pauline Callahan Sent: Sunday, March 11, 2007 4:32 PM To: fulton at exwis.com; sdcbc at bikesandiego.org Subject: Re: [SDCBC] While we are busy citing cvc21200 and cvc21202... ... Action Cyclery in Scripts Ranch/Mira Mesa area has registrations available. Also, there is a "bike fix" community outreach going on next Saturday, March 17 in Tierra Santa (I don't have the exact address, but it is at a church on Tierra Santa Blvd and there are signs) and they will register your bike for free. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.bikesandiego.org/pipermail/sdcbc/attachments/20070312/21ed11d9/attachment.html From JonIsaacs at aol.com Mon Mar 12 12:12:43 2007 From: JonIsaacs at aol.com (JonIsaacs at aol.com) Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2007 12:12:43 EDT Subject: [SDCBC] While we are busy citing cvc21200 and cvc21202... Message-ID: >>>In a message dated 3/12/2007 8:27:03 AM Pacific Daylight Time, j.eldon at sbcglobal.net writes: > To register a bike, I presume one needs to prove ownership. This could be > tough for those of us who ride old bikes, as I do. (My bikes range in age from > 19 to 48 years, and all but one were purchased in very used condition from > private parties.) > > John E. > ------------- John: It would seem that way but IME proof of owner ship is not necessary. I am a slacker in this regard, I currently have ~6% registration rate... jon ************************************** AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at http://www.aol.com. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.bikesandiego.org/pipermail/sdcbc/attachments/20070312/a67112ce/attachment.html From JimBaross at cox.net Mon Mar 12 13:48:34 2007 From: JimBaross at cox.net (Jim Baross) Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2007 10:48:34 -0700 Subject: [SDCBC] While we are busy citing cvc21200 and cvc21202... In-Reply-To: <840753.11283.qm@web52514.mail.yahoo.com> References: <840753.11283.qm@web52514.mail.yahoo.com> Message-ID: <7.0.1.0.2.20070312104613.03b0be50@cox.net> The last time I registered a bike in San Diego (more than two years ago), the bike shop did not have "expires in ____" stickers to go along with the "registered" sticker. There's no way to tell by looking if those bikes are legally registered. Is that a good thing? No. At 07:06 AM 3/11/2007, John Eldon wrote: >I still have an expires-in-1976 Los Angeles Bike Licence sticker on >my 1970 Peugeot UO-8. > >My 1960 Capo has an early 1960s San Diego bicycle license which some >bureaucrat plastered right over the Reynolds 531 decal! From what I >have seen on the Internet, mine is not an isolated instance. > >John E. > >----- Original Message ---- >From: "JonIsaacs at aol.com" >To: sdcbc at bikesandiego.org >Sent: Sunday, March 11, 2007 6:10:10 AM >Subject: Re: [SDCBC] While we are busy citing cvc21200 and cvc21202... > >In a message dated 3/11/07 4:07:15 AM Pacific Standard Time, >gcarman at san.rr.com writes: > >>.>>How many of you are in compliance? -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.bikesandiego.org/pipermail/sdcbc/attachments/20070312/3a85824f/attachment.html From JimBaross at cox.net Mon Mar 12 13:33:28 2007 From: JimBaross at cox.net (Jim Baross) Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2007 10:33:28 -0700 Subject: [SDCBC] want a job? Re: While we are busy citing cvc21200 and cvc21202... In-Reply-To: References: Message-ID: <7.0.1.0.2.20070312101335.03cd6bd0@cox.net> It seems to me that the bike registration process in San Diego and nearby cities could be handled much better by the Coalition if someone was to step up to: 1. research the possibility, the probably benefits to bicycle owners and the Coalition, and likely "costs" to the Coalition. This bike registration is a State program with limits (presently) on the amount that may be charged for the "service". 2. encourage the Mayor and/or City Council to supplement the broken (IMHO) system we have now by adding the someone (the Coalition) as a (or THE?) bike registration provider/administrator, sinc the Fire Dept, Police Dept and bike shops aren't making it work (again IMHO). 3. submit and win a proposal/contract to provide service - service might include: a. partial - stock, sell registrations, and send into police dept (who are supposed to - are they - keep records). We'd only supplement the current processes. b. full - administer the program; stock, sell, record data, retrieve data and cross-reference with found bikes, notify previously register owners of found bikes, provide info to potential buyers of a bike about the registered previous owner if any. This would be a job, part time, but not something I'd expect to go unpaid. The trick is that I don't know how the State limited price for registration could provide enough income to enable a "professional" program.... unless supported by the City (a city with few discretionary funds) or other institution (school district, university, health org, grant?). The only presently successfully operating bicycle registration program that I know of in this State, operated under the State system, is at Univ of Calif. at Davis. If anyone is interested in pursuing this, I can put you in touch with that program's administrator, David T., with little effort. Jim (fix it, change it, or drop the requirement) Baross >>>>>>>> >From: "Pauline Callahan" >Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2007 16:32:18 -0700 > >I just had a conversation with a cyclist who >said he went to several bike shops and they >didn't have the rigistration forms. He said he >ended up in Pacific Baech somewhere. Action >Cyclery in Scripts Ranch/Mira Mesa area has >registrations available. Also, there is a "bike >fix" community outreach going on next Saturday, >March 17 in Tierra Santa (I don't have the exact >address, but it is at a church on Tierra Santa >Blvd and there are signs) and they will register your bike for free. > >---- Begin Original Message ---- > From: Fulton Martin >Sent: Sun, 11 Mar 2007 05:45:42 -0700 >To: sdcbc at bikesandiego.org >Subject: Re: [SDCBC] While we are busy citing cvc21200 and cvc21202... > >I used to register my bicycles regularly, every two (?) years, until I >got my first recumbent and went to the local fire station, where I was >told they wouldn't be doing it anymore. I don't recall them saying the >function was being transferred to retailers, but could be... > >Even *if* retailers are doing it, how willing are they to register a >bicycle "upon the request of the owner" if the bicycle wasn't purchased >at their shop? (Bought my last one out-of-state.) > >Gene Carman wrote: > > Has anyone noticed that part of cvc21200 cites cvc39000? > > > > http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d11/vc21200.htm > > > > 21200. (a) Every person riding a bicycle upon a highway has all the > > rights and is subject to all the provisions applicable to the driver of > > a vehicle by this division, including, but not limited to, provisions > > concerning driving under the influence of alcoholic beverages or drugs, > > and by Division 10 (commencing with Section 20000), Section 27400, > > Division 16.7 (*commencing with Section 39000*), Division 17 (commencing > > with Section 40000.1), and Division 18 (commencing with Section 42000), > > except those provisions which by their very nature can have no application. > > > > > > http://www.dmv.ca.gov/pubs/vctop/d16_7/vc39001.htm > > > > 39001. (a) The department shall procure and distribute bicycle license > > indicia and registration forms to all counties and cities which have > > adopted a bicycle licensing ordinance or resolution. Those counties and > > cities shall issue the indicia and registration form to the owner of any > > new bicycle, and may, upon request of the owner, issue an indicia and > > registration form to the owner of any bicycle which complies with > > Section 39007. > > > > The department shall charge and collect a fee, not to exceed the cost of > > procuring and distributing the license indicia and registration form, > > for each bicycle license indicia and registration form issued. All fees > > collected pursuant to this section shall be deposited in the Motor > > Vehicle Account in the State Transportation Fund. Those fees are hereby > > continuously appropriated from the account for use by the department to > > defray costs to procure and distribute the bicycle license indicia and > > registration forms. > > > > So what is San Diego's policy on license and registration of > > bicycles... assuming they have "adopted a bicycle licensing ordinance > > or resolution?" How many of us are in compliance with the local law, > > should we for instance be pulled over. > > > > If we are quick to cite cvc21200 and cvc21202, should we not also be in > > compliance with SDMC34.02? > > > > > http://clerkdoc.sannet.gov/legtrain/mc/MuniCodeChapter03/Ch03Art04Division00 > > > > > > *?34.02 Bicycle License Required > > *Except as provided by Section 34.09 of this article, it is unlawful for > > any person to operate a bicycle upon any > public street, alley, sidewalk, highway, or > > other public property within the jurisdiction > of The City of San Diego without first > > obtaining a license issued by said City. > Bicycle retailers are authorized and > > directed to issue, upon written application, > a bicycle license, to any person residing > > within the City of San Diego. Bicycle > retailers issuing licenses will charge a fee pursuant > > to section 34.02. Fees collected in > accordance with section 34.02 shall be sent to > > the San Diego Fire Department. *Bicycle > retailers will purchase bicycle licenses and > > stickers from the San Diego Fire Department.* > The San Diego Fire Department will return $1 > > of the $2 license fees collected to bicycle > retailers upon return of a completed > > registration form. License applicants who > reside outside the City of San Diego shall > > be referred to their respective city or > jurisdiction of residency. Any bicycle not > > subject to the provisions of this article may > be licensed upon the request of the owner. > > > > How many of you are in compliance? From JimBaross at cox.net Mon Mar 12 14:03:29 2007 From: JimBaross at cox.net (Jim Baross) Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2007 11:03:29 -0700 Subject: [SDCBC] Fw: Update on Share the Road car licenses Message-ID: <7.0.1.0.2.20070312110222.03cd71e8@cox.net> FYI >Date: Sun, 11 Mar 2007 15:48:40 -0700 (PDT) >From: Shirley Manchester >Subject: Fw: Update on Share the Road >To: Jim Baross > >Hi, Jim. I'm forwarding this to you. This organization is trying to >get signatures for a petition to go to the state-level of California. >I hope you have more contacts that you could 'forward' this on to, >as they still need about 500 signatures. >Thanking you in advance and hoping I haven't overstepped your bounds. >Shirley Manchester >Mission Viejo >Sent: Sunday, March 11, 2007 12:02:07 PM >Subject: Update on Share the Road > >Hi Everyone, > >Here is an update of Share the Road. > >Michelle >[] > > > >WE ARE AT OVER SEVEN THOUSAND (7,144 AT THIS MOMENT) SIGNATURES! > >THANK YOU TO EVERYONE WHO HAS SIGNED! > >[] >[] >[] >[] >[] >[] >[] >[] >[] > >Let's add California to the above state Share the Road plates > >A reminder, we need 7,500 signatures to show the DMV we mean >business and send up to Sacramento, so we need to do just a little >more work to get the word out. Please contact everyone you know, >and mention the Share the Road petition to all in passing. DO NOT STOP NOW! > >There are still lots of areas in California where people do not know >of Share the Road so let's get out there and SPREAD THE WORD! There >are still cyclists out there who have not signed, so LET'S >GO! Please remember that all who sign must be a registered voter in >the state of California , and only sign once. > >THANK YOU FOR ALL YOUR SUPPORT! I will continue to keep you >informed of the advancement toward legislature for Share the Road! > >Together we will make a difference. > >Sincerely, > >Michelle Kashima >OCW chair for Share the Road > >www.sharetheroadsaveslives.com > >sharetheroadsaveslives at cox.net -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.bikesandiego.org/pipermail/sdcbc/attachments/20070312/d569f2fc/attachment-0001.html -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... 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Name: 94a6cf.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 4084 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.bikesandiego.org/pipermail/sdcbc/attachments/20070312/d569f2fc/attachment-0018.jpg -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: 94a6de.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 3697 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://www.bikesandiego.org/pipermail/sdcbc/attachments/20070312/d569f2fc/attachment-0019.jpg -------------- next part -------------- From JonIsaacs at aol.com Mon Mar 12 14:35:43 2007 From: JonIsaacs at aol.com (JonIsaacs at aol.com) Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2007 14:35:43 EDT Subject: [SDCBC] want a job? Re: While we are busy citing cvc21200 and cvc21202... Message-ID: In a message dated 3/12/2007 11:25:56 AM Pacific Daylight Time, JimBaross at cox.net writes: > The only presently successfully operating bicycle > registration program that I know of in this > State, operated under the State system, is at > Univ of Calif. at Davis. If anyone is interested > in pursuing this, I can put you in touch with > that program's administrator, David T., with little effort. Jim: I don't know if it is operated under the state system but UCSD has a registation program that operates in conjunction with the Pedal Club. One of the requirements to be a member of the Pedal Club and get the discount at the bike shop, the 10 day/quarter parking pass and other benefits is to own a currently registered bike. I believe that these days, the UCSD bike shop handles the registration: Jon Jon ************************************** AOL now offers free email to everyone. Find out more about what's free from AOL at http://www.aol.com. -------------- next part -------------- An HTML attachment was scrubbed... URL: http://www.bikesandiego.org/pipermail/sdcbc/attachments/20070312/a297ed79/attachment.html From forester at johnforester.com Mon Mar 12 16:29:59 2007 From: forester at johnforester.com (John Forester) Date: Mon, 12 Mar 2007 13:29:59 -0700 Subject: [SDCBC] want a job? Re: While we are busy citing cvc21200 and cvc21202... In-Reply-To: <7.0.1.0.2.20070312101335.03cd6bd0@cox.net> References: <7.0.1.0.2.20070312101335.03cd6bd0@cox.net> Message-ID: <7.0.1.0.2.20070312132330.03836760@johnforester.com> There is no point in advocating bicycle licenses. The legislation was enacted on the ostensible ground that it would make a major improvement in the recovery rate for stolen bikes. It has not done so, and there is no reason to suspect that it could. There are too many loopholes, administration to close those loopholes is too expensive, counterfeiting bicycle identifications is too easy, bicycle parts are too interchangeable, and others. Those who regard this as some form of identification of the rider of the bicycle are just plain mislead. The program should be shut down. So far as I know, the only real use of the bicycle licensing program has been by cities such as Huntington Beach, which used it to confiscate bicycles ridden in from out of town, and thereby raised a howl. At 10:33 AM 3/12/2007, Jim Baross wrote: >It seems to me that the bike registration process >in San Diego and nearby cities could be handled >much better by the Coalition if someone was to step up to: > >1. research the possibility, the probably >benefits to bicycle owners and the Coalition, and >likely "costs" to the Coalition. This bike >registration is a State program with limits >(presently) on the amount that may be charged for the "service". >2. encourage the Mayor and/or City Council to >supplement the broken (IMHO) system we have now >by adding the someone (the Coalition) as a (or >THE?) bike registration provider/administrator, >sinc the Fire Dept, Police Dept and bike shops >aren't making it work (again IMHO). >3. submit and win a proposal/contract to provide >service - service might include: > a. partial - stock, sell registrations, and >send int