[SDCBC] Bicyclist Dies In Crash With Motorcycle

[Jack Bochsler]

Speculation on what happened is pointless - we are only
going to hear the perspective of the motorist, which may 
contain some self-preserving bias.

Reread my mail, you missed my point.  
The topic was 'veering' and the speed/angle of movement 
relative to different vehicle types, not location of
movement.


--- Serge Issakov <serge at issakov.org> wrote:

> It's possible but not very likely that the cyclist did absolutely
> nothing
> wrong and the motorcyclist simply hit him from behind.  I suppose
> it's also
> possible and arguably slightly more likely that the motoryclist was
> passing
> him too closely, this startled the cyclist, who looked back over his
> left
> shoulder and simultaneously "veered" left into the path of the
> motorcyclist.
> 
> Much more likely is that the cyclist did not notice the motorcyclist
> (perhaps, ironically, because he was looking for a car) and veered in
> front
> of him.
> 
> In any case, the method of turning left from the bike lane at the
> right side
> of the road is all too familar to me.  I see it executed on many
> mornings
> along n/b Regents Rd at the diverge-intersection with Eastgate
>
Mall<http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=en&q=regents+road+at+eastgate+mall,+san+diego,+ca&sll=32.841796,-117.269474&sspn=0.006761,0.010117&ie=UTF8&ll=32.875897,-117.2177&spn=0.003379,0.005059&z=18&om=1&layer=t>
> .
> 
> Cyclists are glued to the bike lane on Regents and veer across the
> right
> traffic lane that becomes the right arm of the "Y" headed for
> Eastgate, to
> get into the left arm to continue on Regents.   They rarely merge
> left
> "vehicularly", which requires starting to merge pretty early, soon
> after
> crossing Executive if not sooner.
> 
> Serge
> 
> 
> 
> On 6/6/07, Jack Bochsler <jbochsler at yahoo.com> wrote:
> > I thought about this - not to be pedantic, but veering means
> > to turn sharply.  But what would be categorized as a sharp
> > turn at 50mph is quite doable and natural at 20mph, and easy
> > at 12mph.  So what would appear to be abrupt actions from the
> > perspective of a motorized vehicle may well be natural behavior
> > from a bicycle.
> >
> > So when crossing a lane to avoid a freeway on-ramp, what appears
> > as a natural, smooth lane crossing to me appears as veering across
> > the lane to the motorist behind me. So both parties can be equally
> > 'right' and 'wrong' in the same situation.
> >
> > Although it would be nice if motorists could account for cyclist
> > specific behavior, history shows otherwise.  And thinking about
> > bicycle peleton behavior, collisions I have seen are a result of
> > cyclists moving quicker than the rider behind can react.
> > So the onus is clearly on a cyclist to move thru traffic as a
> > vehicle would, not as a bicycle can.
> >
> > jack
> >
> > --- Jim Baross <JimBaross at cox.net> wrote:
> >
> > > At the risk of appearing to be too quick to jump to the defense
> of
> > > the bicyclist... something I/we may be accused/guilty of in this
> case
> > >
> > > where we don't know what really happened.... We do know that
> people
> > > on bikes and in vehicles do make mistakes.
> > >
> > > That said, bicyclists veer. It is the nature of a two-wheeled
> device
> > > to need to be steered/veered/moved from side to side to keep
> upright.
> > >
> > > People overtaking such a device should account for that veering
> to
> > > some degree by using safe passing behaviors - slowing until it is
> > > safe to move over to provide safe passing distance. It is not
> > > generally sufficient to continue the same roadway position when
> > > overtaking someone traveling slower.
> > >
> > > But, maybe the motorcyclist did try to pass safely....
> > >
> > > At 09:44 AM 6/6/2007, Jack Bochsler wrote:
> > > >My interpretation of the "bicyclist veered" statements
> > > >is that the bicyclist did not do what the motorist had
> > > >wanted/hoped/desired.
> > > >
> > > >jack
> > > >
> > > >--- Tom Jenney <Thomas.Jenney at Sun.COM> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > They had this story on NBC7/39 TV News this afternoon.  The
> > > reporter
> > > > > said the cyclist just suddenly veered in front of the
> > > motorcyclist, who
> > > > > was unable to stop in time.  Maybe that is what really
> happened
> > > > in this case, but
> > > > > it just seems a little dubious when this is the standard
> > > explanation
> > > > > reported by the media.  It perpetuates the notion that
> bicyclists
> > >
> > > > as a whole
> > > > > don't  know what they are doing on the road and probably
> should
> > > > not be there since
> > > > > they end up getting killed due to their erratic riding
> behavior.
> > > > >
> 



       
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